Friday: At UVa, an Al Groh redux?
LONDON THE NEW GROH?
-Good column today by Doughty, comparing the current UVa situation to what the Cavs faced under Al Groh in 2008. Give it a look-see here.
-I really thought this part was interesting: “What the Cavaliers have learned in recent days was that [ousted DC Jim] Reid was a diligent recruiter, who may have unearthed the sleeper in the state this year in Fork Union safety Malcolm Cook, who has reopened his recruiting since the UVa coaching changes.
One of Virginia’s biggest problems in 2009, Groh’s final season, was an absence of talent. The talent is better now, witness recruiting classes that were ranked 25th by rivals.com in 2011 and 27th in 2012. The class scheduled to sign in February is potentially the best of all, given its current No. 20 ranking, but will it remain intact?”
-First of all, I didn’t know Reid was as active in recruiting as this. Makes the firing of him even more of a head-scratcher. Also, as Jaded Hoo mentioned yesterday: While we’re talking about Hanson, who was also the recruiting coordinator in addition to DL coach, let’s talk about the job he did there. One of London’s reported strengths over his tenure has been the quality of recruits he has been bringing into the program, so you fire the RC?
-To me, that’s the thing. What was the No. 1 reason to believe in London? That he’s an awesome in-game tactician? (nope). A great manager of the clock late in games? (ha-ha). No, it was that he’s been imbuing the program with better players. Seems UVa has jeopardized this, whether these changes were London’s decision or not.
SOUNDING DESPERATE
-The ACC sent out a letter yesterday signed by all the school presidents expressing solidarity. You can read the highlights here.
-This means nothing to me. I think about that phrase Jim Weaver likes to use when he hires coaches. “He/she was the right person for the job AT THIS POINT IN TIME.” That’s how I read this letter, even though that statement isn’t expressed in there. We’re committed to each other at this point in time. Check back with us tomorrow in this ever-changing climate we live in.
-Big Ten commish Jim Delany described his league’s position thusly: “inactive, but alert.” That’s a good way of putting it. And if that’s not how the presidents in the ACC really feel, they are doing their school a disservice.
December 7, 2012 - 8:11 AM
AMc is there any word out of Blacksburg on how ticket sales for the bowl game are proceeding? I know that VT was allocated 13,500 tickets by the RAB (Russell Athletic Bowl), and Jim Weaver stated in an interview that he hoped for 8,000 in sales. What’s the progress thus far?
There’s a bunch of tickets (5,633) available on Stub Hub, for as low as $6…or as high as $200 for club seating. They’re selling for $72 on Hokiesports.com. So, yeah, I don’t think a whole bunch will be sold through the university…
As I mentioned last night on Andy’s blog, the statement if solidarity can drawl allegory to The Fellowship of the Ring. The fellowship got broken up near the end with several characters going separate ways until the final chapters when they were reunited, minus a character or two.
The statement means fluff. It’s like trying to put together Graham’s cracker and s’mores during a hurricane.
I don’t understand what London is trying to achieve, but those coaches he fired have been with him since his days at Richmond, and I think he is drowning in incomptence. It’s a shame because I thought he would help make the interstate rival interesting.
I’ll ask Andy if he’s heard anything but neither one of us expects sales through the school (or sales in general) to be strong. Still, it would be a little too early to draw conclusions from current figures IMO.
The ACC presidents yesterday reminded me a lot of hesad coaches that get a vote of confidence from the owner. Meaning somebody is not going to be around long.
Reports now are that Tennessee has hired Butch Jones. I am sure plenty of Vols fans are drinking the Tennessee Whiskey because the delusions starts now.
And my previous post was typed on the iPhone…stupid autocomplete and autocorrect, using the wrong words in some place. *mutters*
Tough assignment for Jones. He entered a winning culture at his last two stops (following Kelly to CMU and Cincy). Can he make a bad team good?
A good read on Hokie basketball…
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/hokies-journal/post/a-look-into-why-virginia-tech-basketball-is-off-to-its-best-start-in-30-years/2012/12/05/53172516-3ef1-11e2-bca3-aadc9b7e29c5_blog.html
I’d add one more reason – drastically improved 3 point shooting. As in volume of shots attempted, ‘smartness’ of timing and location of shots, and especially in % of shots made.
Tough game coming up this weekend against a dangerous team in a very seriously dangerous location. Let’s make it eight straight! Hey, that rhymes…
Jones turned down Colorado yesterday (wise move) but expectations are very high at UT.
Even when the BE doesn’t lose schools, it loses coaches…..
My memory is sketchy right now, but didn’t Butch Jones benefitted from working with previous regime’s recruits rather than his own?
Yeah, he’s about to step into a pressure cooker at Tennessee, not just because it’s the SEC, but also because of the vocal fans base, as Crooked Road mentioned yesterday.
I think the set of the over/under of his survivability is at 4 years.
It’s always fun to talk about young men who play games, but here’s something about some young men who had other things on their minds…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMXnCwQLlac
Hokies up to No. in ESPN’s ACC hoops power rankings. Seems to me the tomorrow’s WVU game is exactly the kind of the game they would lose under Greenberg. Can they keep the good vibes going?
Aaron, only, and only if they can beat the 1-3-1 zone which WVa runs with uncanny precision. Also, because of Huggins, WVa loves to jack up 3s, so I would expect to see a lot of rebounding and transition opportunities for the Hurrying Hokies, kind of like how they beat VMI. However, I heard that WVa’s 6’10″ player is now eligible and should be playing tomorrow. That’s gonna be an interesting match up for JVG, Raines, and Wood.
As to the scenario for a Hurrying Hokies loss, AMc, your premise is askew. The game that Tech would have lost under Greenberg would probably have been OkState, because there always seemed to be some inexplicable game where the players went into a stupor and we blew what should have been a win, and because we often seemed to lose grasp of golden opportunities for ‘quality’ OOC wins in November/December.
West Virginia is better than their record. By season’s end, they’ll be a quality RPI win, should we manage it. If we lose, there’s no shame in that, because we went into the lion’s den. If we win, to me it will be a better quality win than OkState, because of location & circumstances.
I’ll keep saying this all season, and maybe for the next couple – it’s not about the W-L record, it’s about building the program. Not a sprint, but a marathon. So far, so good…
In non-sports news, anybody hear about the British radio station DJ’s who called into the hospital and got a report on Kate Middleton’s (Princess Kate?) condition? The nurse gave them some basic info, nothing unusual or extremely private. The DJ’s, of course, put it on air, etc. Of course, since it was royal family-related, it created a buzz.
What happened to the nurse who was duped into releasing the innocuous information? She committed suicide this morning. Meanwhile, the radio station said they were sorry if they ‘upset’ anyone, but they’re pleased to know that Kate is doing well.
Trev, WVU is especially dangerous in transition as well. One of Tech’s weaknesses has been attacking zones & getting penetration. Hopefully, they can step it up…
Belk Bowl officials report that they’ve sold over 46,000 tickets thus far for the Cincinnati-Duke contest. The pairing was announced Sunday evening, along with the full bowl lineup. Belk officials also expect total attendance to meet or exceed the average attendance of approximately 60,000.
Oops, forgot the link…
http://www.rr.com/local/topic/article/rr/4473267/78622375/Charlotte_trip_is_sweet_for_Blue_Devils
As you can see, Belk Bowl officials are eager to share their positive results about their bowl.
Butch Jones was head coach for 3 years at each Central Mich. and then Cincinnati. His best years were his 3rd and last year (actually his regular season record at Cinn. in his 2nd and 3rd year were the same). In his first season at these schools he was a combined 12-18. At La. Tech, Dooley was 4-8 his last season before UT hired him. There is no way to predict how Jones will do but if past performance is any inicator, it seems UT learned it’s lesson.
CR, I’m well aware of the Hokies’ weakness. Spotted it during the VMI game, they had fits with the full court pressure and zone defense, and that’s mainly because the those sets are designed to slow down tempo, and get the defense digging in their heels. I think JJ will have to draw up an attack plan to get Erick Green into the heart of the zone defense, and kick it out to an open wing shooter. The challenge is the Hokies don’t have a true back-to-the-basket post player that can demand double team every time he is on the block. Raines comes close to it, but I don’t think he has the bulk or footwork to be a bruiser down low. That’s not a criticism of him, it is an observation.
The 1-3-1 zone is effective at cutting off passing lanes and taking away post players, forcing the players to attack from the perimeter and beyond the arc, giving the team a chance to collect handsome amount of rebounds.
Shot selections are going to be extremely important for the Hokies in order to win the game against WVa. I haven’t seen the ‘neers play yet, but based on what I have seen the year before and before that, the zone are a headache. I remember the final rounds that the ‘neers and Puke played in, the zone defense did a great job of limiting Puke’s inside players, forcing their shooters to fire up a lot of jumpers. It was a close game until one of the ‘neers’ best players went down with a torn ACL. It became all Puke after that.
If the Hokies win tomorrow, they will have tons of respect from the ACC, and I believe that the pundits who picked them to finish in the bottom are going to regret it. I might be bold in making this prediction, but I honestly believe that Tech can hang with the best of the ACC this year.
Aaron, gotta disagree with you on the ACC statement. If this were signed by AD’s, then I wouldn’t think it was worth the paper it was printed on, but college presidents operate a little differently. They are not going to blindly agree to put their moniker on something like this unless they really mean it.
Butch Jones has a tough assignment, but he does have some decent players. He just has to avoid too bad of a recruiting year that creates a gap in the depth chart down the road.
I just don’t think Dooley was worth a damn as a coach, not at that level. He may be La Tech good, but he wasn’t SEC caliber.
I think Kiffin just put them in a bad spot, in terms of what he did, how he did it, and when he did it, and Dooley was the best they could do at the time.
Little tidbit of information. UT didn’t exactly have a stellar QB, but they could’ve. Tajh Boyd committed to UT first, and Kiffin pulled the offer when he came along, said he didn’t want him, because he was not ‘a QB suited for his system.’
UT is an unusual situation. You really don’t rely too heavily on in-state recruits, you have to stretch it quite a bit, because Tennessee is not exactly a recruiting hotbed, and the Volunteer fanbase is one of the most delusional in all of college sports.
And, yep, this WVU would be a game Tech would lose under Greenberg. We’ll see if the new style of play works. OK State was a big win, but getting a solid road W is important for team confidence later on.
Butch Jones will sign his Tennessee contract to the tune of six years, $18 million. That’s a $1 million annual discount from what was offered Charlie Strong of Louisville. That should give you an idea of the funding UofL has for their sports programs, and a clearer picture of why the ACC welcomed them into the tent.
Anyone still afraid of the big bad Cavs?
I think its time to put SG to bed and stop talking about him. This is now JJ’s team and right, wrong or indifferent his stamp is now on them. The fact that they got off to a hot start, are better than anyone expected and have deeper talent than we thought just shows that we who sit in the cheap seats don;t always know what we are talking about.
Myself, Crooked Road and a bunch of others would have bet the ranch against 7-0 after the first couple games. No idea what is to come but JJ has earned the right to be judged on his own merit.
Trev, I think the Hurrying Hokies 2.0 are in a good spot this year, due solely to Johnson’s adroitness in assuming command under positively horrible circumstances – ‘thanks’ to Weaver’s handling of the Greenberg dismissal.
Tech will get a lot of credit if they win tomorrow, and little criticism if they lose. I mean, everyone will look at a loss (should it occur) and say – ‘Well, they weren’t supposed to win but so much this year, anyway…’
As far as conference play, I wouldn’t go so far as to say they’ll be in the top of the conference. If – IF – they continue their play like thus far, they’ll certainly rise above the bottom third. I had them in bottom third prior to the season. Now, they look like they could make it to the middle third. You just never know until they get a couple of games under their belts.
I remember Marquis Rankin, and before him Erik Green, looked good prior to conference play their freshman years. Once conference play started, you could see their eyes get as big as saucers, and the turnovers begin. So we’ll have to wait until mid-January to know for sure. That whole marathon thing again.
Regardless, they’ve drastically exceeded expectations thus far. Johnson is even getting a little talkative with the press, so that’s also a positive. I’d like to see him establish a strong identity for himself and the program. An identity of their own.
James Johnson has definetly been a breath of fresh air in the basketball program, where as everything ended on such a sour and negative note. The guys seem to be playing with alot of confidence, as well as playing loose but focused basketball. Winning will do that obviously, but the chemistry this team is building within themselves and with their new coach can only pay dividends late in the season.
Zman, I don’t think the talent pool is deeper, excepting Johnston, so that’s only one body extra. What I think is that the supporting players have ‘stepped their game up’ to quote Floyd Mayweather. I said before the season, IIRC, that Raines & Brown would have to double their points & rebounds to help Green & for the team to win. Raines went from 6pts/4reb last year to 9pts/7reb this season. Brown went from 7pts to 13.4pts this year. More importantly, Green has made an equivalent leap in production – an additional 10 points in scoring.
Johnson has done a masterful job of blending in his reserves. It’s just seamless. Everybody in the top nine is getting lots of playing time, and it is working quite well.
I’ll agree about the ‘turn the page’ sentiment for Johnson. One last caveat – I appreciated the tenacity of our last coach, his never backing down, especially against Carolina & Duke. I appreciate just as much the determination of Johnson. He doesn’t show it physically, but he’s not a mouse on the sidelines. He’s from the Coach K school, where he can chew out an official when needed, but not embarrass the official. That is to be appreciated, by the fans & the officials, too, I’m sure. That also can work in our favor, as hopefully (fingers crossed) VaTech will now be off the hit list for officials and NCAA tourney decision makers.
Long post, I know. I’m quite happy with Johnson & company. Regardless of their W-L record, as long as they continue playing in this manner, they’re on the right track in building the program.
Zman, prior to the season, I had us at 5-3 after the WVU game, and 8-5 going into ACC play. I figured us at 4-14 in the ACC to finish 12-20 with a first round loss in the ACC tourney. That was my August-October prediction.
As of now? I’ll put us at 11-2 going into ACC play. I haven’t revisited the ACC schedule to update my estimate on that yet. Maybe that’s a weekend project. I’ll rough us in as being in the middle third of the ACC right now.
To me, that’s a huge season. If Johnson ends up with an 18 win regular season, he ought to get ACC coach of the year. That sounds crazy, but considering expectations, I could argue that. Of course, I’m getting ahead of myself. Got to calm down, take deep slow breaths, ha ha ha… Think of a lovely field of wildflowers, come back to Earth. Remind myself – long season, not a sprint, it’s a marathon…
cr, I had basically the same pre-season predictions/expectations, but I can see 10 +/-1 wins in the OOC, and maybe 6-7 wins in the ACC this year. A winning record would be a phenominal result, given that he’s a new HC, lost some players to transfers, and is working with just 8 scholarship players on the roster. As of this point, I already find it difficult to not consider the season a successful transition…Johnson seems to be getting more from the team than SG was able to.
One glaring difference between playing under SG and JJ are the swagger. I can’t recall anyody having and playing with swagger, owning Cassell and just owning stuff right now.
I haven’t done any number crunching, running off of memory, but I think one key in all the wins are the number of rebounding edges that have gone to the Hokies’ favor. I am a firm believer in which teams wins the rebounding battle wins the game.
——
Just read on Twitter that Tony Franklin has been hired as an OC at California, much to the chargin of many fans who were hoping he would be coming to Blacksburg. Just thought I would add that here.
Zman, I’m with CR on this – this is not necessarily deeper talent, because the very most successful teams only go 8 or 9 deep, and some even just 7 deep. This team is all about chemistry. Basketball is more chemistry than talent. That’s why teams like Butler and Gonzaga do what they do. They don’t have the super talent, they have the chemistry.
After all, most of those guys on the floor can jump thru the ceiling and slam an impressive dunk home. They are all talented, it is how you blend it together.
I happen to think the VT basketball egg cracks in Morganhole this weekend. It is a tough place to play and Huggins, much as I don’t care for him, is a heckuva coach.
If we are lucky it will be a WVU blowout which will be easier for VT to recover from. Close losses tend to stick with you longer.
You are correct, it will be a WVU blowout.
A loss this weekend won’t be disastrous. We won’t be undefeated, that’s all. We’ll still be far ahead of projections. This season’s not about wins & losses, it’s about Johnson establishing himself as an ACC caliber coach, and his players buying into what he’s selling. A short handed team could get buried in the ACC easily. If we make it through the Hurt Locker of the ACC without getting blown up, we’ll be fine.
Trev, actually the Hokies are a little weak in rebounding, especially in offensive rebounding. Where they’ve made the biggest critical gains are – 3pt shooting, FT %, & FG %.
As for Tony Franklin coming to VT, I said from the beginning that was only a fantasy solution of the koolaid krowd. Tony Franklin played at Murray State with Bud Foster & then Beamer coached at Murray State, so the twist in logic was that put Tony Franklin inside the Frank Beamer bubble of trust, so he was desirable. It’s exactly the same mentality that too many think makes Ralph Friedgen the ideal candidate as Offensive Coordinator because he is supposedly Frank’s best friend. Once again, the fear of outside influence…
I’d love to see outside influences help evolve Hokie football, but I really don’t see that happening under Frank Beamer. What I do see happening is what I outlined earlier this week. The whole Kevin Rogers, etc. thing. I’m not saying that’s what I want to happen, but it’s what I think will happen.
Trev, looking at the numbers, here’s some keys…
We’re scoring 20+ points more per game than last year, and 15+ more than our average of the last five seasons.
We’re only getting about 4 more rebounds per game than last year, and a couple more than our 5 yr average, despite taking a lot more shots. Offensive rebounds need the most work. What’s happening is we’re surrendering them to get back on transition defense. I think Johnson has ceded that this season, but I hope he will focus on that next year. He’s said he plans on implementing a full court pressing defense with half court trapping once he has enough players – i.e. next year & beyond. That sounds promising to me, so I can wait one year. It might cost us 2-3 wins this season, though.
Assists are fractionally better, and turnovers are about equal. Since we’re running much more, that explains the assists not changing, and the turnovers being equal means we’re doing better in that despite moving up/down the court much faster.
Fg shooting is up from an average of around .420′s to this season it’s currently .483. We’re running, so getting fast break opportunities and converting. We’re not taking desperation shots with less than 10 seconds remaining, so the players are more confident.
FT shooting, long a weakness is now a strength. We’re shooting .780 as a team, which is really good.
Most importantly, we’re shooting a lot more 3′s. We’re doing that in transition as well as in set plays. To top that, we’re making a whole lot more of those we take. We’re shooting over .400 on 3′s! Our 5 yr average was in the low .300′s.
Lots of numbers, but lots of encouragement among them.
AM,
Thanks for the shoutout above. I really appreciate it. Busy day at work today, so a little slow on getting this up. I had a friend comment last night that maybe London had the same trouble firing coaches that he has picking QB’s–maybe he was told by admin that 4 had to go, so he just drew straws for who would get the ax.
Skimmed the discussion today on the Hokies’ surprise start–really good insight by all. I think JJ is a great story. One observation from the other side of fandom, I think a lot of hoos thought about SG the same way a lot of hokies on here thought about AG. Either way, a breath of fresh air is great for all involved.
Good grief. You Hokies thing beating a .500 team is a feather in your cap. You could lose this game if Erik Green comes back to earth.
Roll Tide!
crooked, I’m not sure where the Tony Franklin stuff came from, but there is a much more exciting possibility out there . . . if it works out.
Rick H, you piqued my curiosity. The name?
There appears to be a current football phobia in Charlottesville. Fear of a moving van.Hope the new assistants hired keep a good real estate agent, including the one who teaches London some clock management skills and on the sidelines prowess with officials and players.
Now why all the fear oiver West Virginia and how is beating a 3-3 team a “quality road win”?
They were famous for referee home cooking when I was a student but I wonder about that now.
As far as “deeper” goes, much was made by those of you who are now on the bandwagon that VT was doomed because we had only 9 scholorship players and I recall comments about Green “needing help” because there was no one on the bench (CR I think that was you).
All I am saying is that SG is past and talking about his strengths and weaknesses doesn’t have any meaning now. This is JJ’s team with an uptempo style. They are doing much better tahn anyone, including me, expected.
I have no idea how the rest of the season will go or if we will get more “signature wins” but we are off to a great start and I say good for us.
GO HOKIES!!
Zman, try reading some of my posts besides those you find negative, and you might understand context. For example, #26 above, which was specifically a response to you prior. Then you’ll see the rest of the long ago post of mine that you like to only remember one part of, and perhaps even you will understand the context. Or not.
As to claiming people are now jumping on the bandwagon – you yourself just admitted they are doing better than ‘even you’ expected, so I guess you’re labeling yourself as a bandwagon fan? Is it not possible you just accept they’re a pleasant surprise without being so eager to smear others? Such negativity is not healthy…
Crooked Road, did you really say “Negativity is not healthy”? Oh my gosh!! Are you the same Crooked Road who constantly posts everything, I mean 100% everything negative about Coach Beamer and staff?
danny, negativity towards posters does not breed enthusiasm. Analysis of coaches does not always equate to negativity. If I were to post that VaTech football had the 78th ranked scoring offense in the nation out of 120 teams, you’d squeal that I was being negative. Actually, I’d be factual. If I were to post that Stinespring’s produced more offenses rated 100th or worse in the nation than he has offenses ranked inside the top 40, you’d say I was being negative, when actually that is factual. When I post that Frank Beamer refuses to accept the responsibility for poor performance, and instead hides behind cliches like ‘we were 4-5 plays away from winning’, it’s based on the quotes in media & interviews, making it factual. Yet you label it negativity. It’s just what he said, repeated & provided context. Since it seems contrary to what you like, you label it negativity. Very unhealthy, danny, very unhealthy.
I’ve praised VT basketball more this season than any other poster on here, and that seems to bother you? We all know what bothers you is that I post something that reveals Frank Beamer or his staff to be less than perfect, and that’s not something you want to accept. I can’t apologize for that, danny. That’s your issue, not mine.
Me? I’m enjoying basketball season. We’re only a quarter of the way into it, so a lot of good & bad can still occur. It’s not about the wins & losses, it’s about building the program. Not a sprint, it’s a marathon.
Crooked Road, let’s suppose VT goes to Orlando and has a great game. Offense, defense, special teams all perform well and VT comes away with an impressive win. Would you be able to make “positive” comments on this or any other site regarding Beamer, Stinespring, etc? I would say you could not bring yourself to do that. That’s my point about you being 100% negative. In fact, I believe you would be bitterly disappointed if VT has a good bowl game.
I posed this question to you previously but got no response.
Sorry, crooked, I’m sworn to secrecy.