Welcome to the Wednesday OPEN thread
Shot by Dan Monday on Yellow Mountain Road
“My father described this tall lady who stands in the middle of the New York harbor, holding high a torch to welcome people seeking freedom in America. I instantly fell in love.”
Yakov Smirnoff
July 11, 2012 - 1:10 PM
THE FENCE TEST
Which side of the fence?
If you ever wondered which side of the fence you sit on, this is a great
test!
If a Republican doesn’t like guns, he doesn’t buy one.
If a Democrat doesn’t like guns, he wants all guns outlawed.
If a Republican is a vegetarian, he doesn’t eat meat.
If a Democrat is a vegetarian, he wants all meat products banned or
regulated for everyone.
If a Republican is homosexual, he leads his life.
If a Democrat is homosexual, he demands legislated respect.
If a Republican is down-and-out, he thinks about how to better his
situation.
If a Democrat is down and out, he wonders who is going to take care of
him.
If a Republican doesn’t like a talk show host, he switches channels.
if a Democrat doesn’t like a talk show host, he demands that he/she be
taken off the air.
If a Republican is a non-believer, he doesn’t go to church.
If a Democrat is a non-believer, he wants any mention of God and religion
silenced.
If a Republican needs health care, he shops for it, or finds a job that
provides it.
If a Democrat needs health care, he demands that the rest of us provide
it.
If a Republican doesn’t like gay marriage, he makes sure that nobody can have gay marriage.
If a Democrat doesn’t like gay marriage, he doesn’t marry another guy.
Two can play at this.
Michael Howdyshell, the Republican/Democrat FENCE TEST you have proposed is ridculous. Because I am a crack editor, I have tried to make it more factual (but it’s still far from perfect). The additions are in italics.
Which side of the fence?
If you ever wondered which side of the fence you sit on, this is a great
test!
If a Republican doesn’t like guns, he doesn’t buy one.
If a Democrat isn’t 100% in support of all gun rights all the time, the gun crowd claims he wants all guns outlawed.
If a Republican is a vegetarian, he shuts up and doesn’t eat meat.
If a Democrat is a vegetarian, he doesn’t eat meat. And he may or may not urge food safety regulations on all food commercially sold to the public so that fewer Republicans and others will die of food poisoning.
If a Republican is homosexual, he shuts up and leads his life, unless he is a Log Cabin Republican or the father of a homosexual daughter such as Dick Cheney.
If a Democrat is homosexual, he demands not to be discriminated against because of his sexual orientation.
If a Republican is down-and-out, he thinks about how to better his
situation.
If a Democrat is down and out, he wonders who is going to take care of
him.
If a Republican doesn’t like a talk show host, he shuts up and switches channels, unless he is a mamber of the American Family Association, in which case he joins and promotes advertiser boycotts of that host, which is an exercise of his constitutional rights. But he will leave to the network the decision as to whether the host should be taken off the air.
If a Democrat doesn’t like a talk show host, he may join and promote advertiser boycotts of that host as an exercise of his constitutional rights. But he will leave to the network the decision as to whether the host should be taken off the air.
If a Republican is a non-believer, he doesn’t go to church.
If a Democrat is a non-believer, he may or may not seek to stop government entities from promoting Islam, or Wicca, or any other religion over another.
If a Republican needs health care, he shops for it, or finds a job that
provides it. Or if he is John Roberts he may uphold a law that requires freeloaders to go into the private market and and buy insurance.
If a Democrat needs health care, he is happy that Republican Justice John Roberts has joined the majority to uphold a market-based solution first suggested by the Heritage Foundation and Newt Gingrich that requires individuals to buy health insurance.
What good is a fence when it is the post so obviously stuck up your…
If a Republican doesn’t like guns, he is laughed out of the party.
If a Republican doesn’t like gun violence, he builds a gated community with a guard and leaves the rest of us to die.
If a Democrat is a vegetarian, Republicans make fun of them.
If a Democrat is homosexual, Republicans try to legislate it out of them.
If a Democrat is down and out, Republicans blame him and see that he stays there.
If a Democrat doesn’t like a talk show host, Republicans make them an icon and parrot their bile.
If a Democrat is a non-believer, Republicans assure us they are going to hell for it and we better shut up and let them pray publicly or we will go even sooner.
If a Democrat needs health care, Republicans demand he has the freedom not to get it.
If a Democrat gives a poor man a hand because he needs it, Republicans demand two for themselves because they want it.
Michael Howdyshell’s game is getting fun. . .
Way to go Sandi…
If a liberal has a pot gut and more than one chin, did they eat more than their fair share?
Why do liberals with a double chin, support other pot gut people telling everyone else how to eat?
Is a liberal who slacks at work all day, yet take their paycheck, stealing from their employer or just sticking it to the Capitalist man.
Does R/T really get paid when someone clicks on this blog? If so, is that a leftist grab at money under false pretense?
If a Republican is a non-believer, he doesn’t dare reveal that to other Republicans because he might be drummed out of the party.
If a Democrat is a non-believer, he still supports the right of others to believe as they please, as long as they don’t display it on public property or at pubvlic governmental functions
If a Republican is down and out, he becokmes a Democrat.
If a Democrat is down and out, he believes in society lending a hand to help him get back on his feet again.
If a Republican is a homosexual that is an oxymopron because by definition
a homosexual can’t be a Republican.
If a Democrat is a homosexual, he believes that he deserves to be protected from abuse and discrimination because of his sexual orientation
If a Republican needs health care, he can onbly get it as long as the provision of it creates a profit for an insurance company and its shareholders.
If a Democrat needs health care, he believes it is an ovbligation of society to see that adequate health care is available to everyone, whether an insurance company or health care giant makes 25% or not.
If a Republican doesn’t like guns, he doesn’t buy one. This, of course never happens because all Republicans love guns and the NRA.
If a Democrat doersn’t like guns, he believes that he has the right to live without being constantly threatened by people who are able to obtain guns like buying bubble gum at the supermarket..
BTW – Michael Howdyshell’s post was lifted from a 2010 “spam” that made the rounds like a chain letter:
http://www.eligr.com/2010/04/simple-political-affiliation-test-the-fence-test/
Shrillary
Of course it was. Anything not coming from a right wing blog or faux news
talking head or the bat guano crazy internet wingers would be too much to ask for.
So the republicans spent another day frittering time away, not voting to create jobs, oh no! they have, for the 33rd time, wasted time on trying to repeal the Affordable Care Act – otherwise know as ObamaCares… which the Supreme Court upheld…but they just can’t get over that FACT and simply move on…
Shrillary,
And everyone of those who voted with the Republicans today are participants in a government provided healthcare program which they want to deny to millions of Americans.
This Friday, July 13, is the 225th anniversary of the passage of the Northwest Ordinance by the Congress of the Conferation of the U.S. This ordinance created the framework of governance for the Northwest Territory that would ultimately become the states of Ohio, Michigan, Indiana, Illinois and Wisconsin and parts of present day of Minnesota. Among the many aspects of the Ordinance was the prohibition of slavery in the new territory.
CBS 6:30 news said that the last two weeks spent attempting to repeal the ACA cost the taxpayer nearly 48 million dollars.
@11 You do realize that the obama doesn’t care requires you to buy insurance.. or pay a tax? Yes the largest tax increase in history! There is nothing free about it..Also 5 new taxes to hit starting next year. Also the vote was bipartisan even dems voted for it’s repeal.
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/07/05/five-major-obamacare-taxes-that-will-hit-your-wallet-in-2013/
Folks have been standing in line for over two hours on peters creek rd. For Obama tickets. Expect a big crowd
If Micheal Howdyshell had a socio-economic cushion that allowed him to spend his college time partying as a frat boy without penalty, he doesn’t admit it.
If a Democrat doesn’t have the socio-economic cushion to spend their time at college partying, they spend most of their time studying, not partying.
If Micheal Howdyshell received a crucial boost to career success from a mentor, he thinks he pulled himself up by his own bootstraps.
If a Democrat receives a crucial boost to career success from a mentor, Micheal claims they only got there from affirmative action.
If Micheal Howdyshell wins a bid for government construction work, he doesn’t think he’s benefitting from taxes.
If a Democrat wins a bid for government construction work, they realize that infrastructure must be paid for.
If Micheal Howdyshell is already paying for the healthcare of many others, he can’t seem to understand how.
If a Democrat is already paying for the healthcare of many others, they know that the ACA will spread those costs over a broader base of payers, and are glad that it will also lower unrecoupable costs in the long run.
If Micheal Howdyshell gets a tax break from Pres. Obama, he calls Obama a tax raiser.
If a Democrat gets a tax break from President Obama, they know it, whether they be Bill Gates, Warren Buffet, or one of the 98% least rich Americans.
If Micheal Howdyshell thinks we should steal another country’s resources, he’s willing to have his sons die attempting the theft.
If a Democrat hears calls to steal another country’s resources, they resist sending anyone’s children to die attempting theft.
If Micheal Howdyshell hasn’t heard about something happening to anyone he knows, he thinks it doesn’t exist or isn’t very bad.
If a Democrat hasn’t heard about something happening to anyone they know, they understand that their own experience is not comprehensive.
If Micheal Howdyshell encounters an accurately nuanced version of history, he insists it’s less accurate than a simplistic Disney-fied version of history.
If a Democrat encounters an accurately nuanced version of history, he isn’t watching Faux News.
If Micheal Howdyshell hears Sarah Palin, he thinks she sounds quite well informed and intellectually adept.
If a Democrat hears Sarah Palin, they think she sounds even less well informed and intellectually adept than other reality TV show stars.
If Micheal Howdyshell posts a simple minded list full of absurdly inaccurate generalizations, it came from some years old spam.
If a Democrat posts a simple minded list full of absurdly inaccurate generalizations, it’s a re-post from Micheal Howdyshell’s inbox.
1 Michael.
Superb! Thanks for those gems. You definitely hit a nerve with the libtards. They’re screeching like scalded dogs.
You’re absolutely correct. Republicans handle everything without trying to impose restrictions on others. Democrats blame everybody else and try to dictate their behavior.
CBS 6:30 news said that the last two weeks spent attempting to repeal the ACA cost the taxpayer nearly 48 million dollars.
So what’s new about Democrats spending taxpayer money fighting against the will of the people?
While most humane people have never heard the sound described in post #18, the poster admits to joining the infamous dog murderer Micheal Vick in knowing exactly what it sounds like. Thank you, God, for leaving the poster childless.
Actually Suzie, we are being very creative in response to a canned reissue of someone else’s “work”. But I can see where you automaton conservatives would totally miss that.
Some of these are Hall of Fame material and we didn’t need to copy anyone else to do it.
#15 Maloof,
Look, slapnuts, stop being an ignoramus; this “Largest tax increase ever” grab-assery is getting kind of stale.
“The health care law’s tax increases are smaller than tax increases signed into law by President Ronald Reagan in 1982”
If you want to fritter away your day chasing unicorns that’s your prerogative but just don’t expect not to be beaten senseless by the stupid stick for your transgressions. This issue has been decided and the train’s left the station and you’re standing on the platform scratching your junk and wondering where everybody went.
http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2012/jul/11/american-commitment/health-care-law-largest-tax-increase-history-middl/
Clue; they’re probably not watching fox news. Just because it caters to your insecurities and comprehension level (5th grade) doesn’t mean its fair, balanced or right. Now stop being a dolt and consume news responsibly.
I believe there are three kinds of liberals. I have numbered them 1,2, and 3. 1) There are people who genuinely believe in helping others and the best way to help others is through Government assistance. While I don’t call all these folks socialist they tend to believe in taking from the haves and giving to the have not’s to help make everything fair. For the most part these are good honest people. They believe in people over profits, the environment over growth and acceptance for all. While I disagree with these kind on most everything I generally like them and call many my friends. 2) People who resent others for being successful either through hard work, birth or a combination of both. They probably resent successful people because they recognize that they don’t have what it takes to succeed in a capitalist society. They resent people that were born into a more comfortable setting than they were and want to take it away from them. These people are not good folks, resentment is a horrible thing. I had a suit mate like this at UT, he had to work full time and borrow money to go to school. He had a huge resentment for folks that did not have to work and played a lot. What a miserable way to go through life, resenting what others have instead of trying to get there yourself. 3) I call these the limousine liberals. They could care less about the folks but understand demographics. They understand there are a hell of a lot more people that make 50K a year or less than there are that make 250K. They are in it simply for the votes and the support. These in my opinion are the worst kind of liberals.
Before the insults start I understand there are many types of folks that call themselves conservatives some good and some bad. My point to my liberal friends is I don’t think all of you are bad people. I also understand there are bad conservatives.
Warren
I have been the first to admit I have been very lucky. My older brother told me that born into our family we would have had to tried really hard not to be somewhat successful. He also told me I was trying really hard to be a failure. My brother had a 3.92 undergraduate GPA in Chemistry, I think I was a disgrace to him. I make fun of my undergraduate days (best 5 1/2 years of my life) because I can. In all honesty I should have made a lot better grades, which is one reason I decided to go to graduate school to prove I could make grades when I tried and I did. I also give a tremendous amount of credit to my Mentor without whom I would not be where I am today. Believe me when I say I have done a lot for him in return. I really think you take this way too seriously. Loosen up dude!
I know Dan, but I do think its funny. It is the little things in life you know.
just a note to all the republicans, democrats, and independents on this
blog and all the voters in this country.
MAKE YOUR VOTE COUNT IN NOVEMBER
if OBUMA is re-elected there will never be another presidental election,
by 2016 OBUMA will have turned this nation into a socialist republic and
will have declared himself SUPREME RULER for life!
And there are two kinds of Conservatives. There areb conservatives like
George H.W. Bush, Ronald Reagan, Bob Dole, Gerald Ford and others of their type who were fiscal conservatives but understood how politics work and that the continued progress of our country has always depended on the willingness of people of good will but differing opinions to sit down and compromise.
Then there are conservatives like the rabid, socially conservative, fire and brimstone, take no prisoners, the hell with everybody else I am always right, don’t ever compromise folks who have taken over today’s Republican Party and brought us to the brink of financiaql disaster
and revolution. People like Limbaugh, Hannity, Norquist, Alan West,
and like the Suzies, Maloofs, , LC’s, wills, pamallalalas and others who post here. They are haters, and bigots, and believe in their own set of facts, which in reality are just opinions issuing from their lack of knowledge and prejudices.
I have conservative friends who are ashamed of today’s Republican Party.
I have liberal friends who agree with me that there are things about government that need to be reformed, areas where cuts can and must be made,
changes to Social Security and Medicare that are essential to preser\ve them for the future. But they, and my conservative friends also recognize that we cannot cut our way out of this fiscal crisis, that there must be a combination of trimming and revenue increases (yes taxes) to make us whole again.
The radical elements who refuse to recognize this and have brought us to a standstill are ruining America and if they get in control, they will effedctively end us as a democratic republic and turn us into a feudal plutocracy.
Thanks Dave a very reasonable post.
Dave, I think you, Kristen and Gdad are among the good liberals.
I have conservative friends who are ashamed of today’s Republican Party.
I am ashamed of today’s Republican Party. They are too timid about playing the winning hand they have. They could have had any deal they wanted last summer but Boehner caved on the debt ceiling deal, and our leadership has been caving ever since.
Better dig that hole a little deeper Colorado Max…
And there are two kinds of Conservatives.
There are also two kinds of liberals: the leaders who want to ensure their power through a big government socialist utopia by hoodwinking as many people as possible.; and the clueless tools who do their bidding.
Guess which ones populate this blog.
You can add colorado max to category 2 above!.
As many of you may remember, I have posted about this issue from time-to-time.
http://tinyurl.com/7lxc75d
**
FBI, Justice Department reviewing forensic evidence in thousands of cases
By Carol Cratty, CNN
updated 4:26 PM EDT, Wed July 11, 2012
Washington (CNN) — The FBI and Justice Department are undertaking a broad review of thousands of criminal cases to see if any defendants were wrongly convicted based on faulty forensics, the department said Wednesday.
“The department and the FBI are in the process of identifying historical cases for review where a microscopic hair examination conducted by the FBI was among the evidence in a case that resulted in a conviction,” said Justice Department spokeswoman Nanda Chitre. “We remain committed to working closely with our law enforcement partners to go through thousands of cases, all of which are more than a decade old, and to assemble evidence for purposes of conducting a thorough and meaningful review of convictions.”
The Washington Post first reported the review. This follows a report by the newspaper in April that Justice officials had known for years that questionable forensic evidence or testimony might have occurred in some trials in which defendants were convicted, but that no new look at the cases had taken place, and that defendants and their lawyers had not been informed of possible problems in the evidence.
SNIP
**
Maybe some progress will now be made.
FWIIW, I would support a new law that required that all defendants and their lawyers had be informed of possible problems in the forensics evidence. I think that when when problems in the evidence are established (e.g., the so-called comparative bullet lead analysis which I posted about before) there should be an automatic appeal required.
[See http://tinyurl.com/7s999df for but one report on the lead in bullets issue. Here is another one: http://tinyurl.com/6sxj9el Also, see: http://tinyurl.com/89k2lcp for the FBI's own double-talk press release.]
So while I’m having a rare bout with insomnia, I’ll just say I wish to hell you liberals could get to live in the ultimate extension of the policies you want — Cuba. Government is all-powerful there. Total “free’ health care, You know, that generous socialism which puts people first and all live bountiful lives? Well, at least the Castro regime has lived well. He’s a billionaire. The people live like pigs however. You go to Cuba, you think it’s the 1930s.
The only difference between Castro and 0bama is one used bullets to retain power. The other hasn’t quite reached that stage yet.
Please move there, liberals. It’s got everything you say you want.
Continuing what I started yesterday, below is a little more info regarding the Northwest Territory Ordinance.
In 1787, Congress adopted the Northwest Ordinance, which provided a model for the organization of future territories. The ordinance gave Congress the power to divide the area into three to five separate territories. Congress would appoint a governor, a secretary, and three judges to govern each territory. When a territory had 5000 free adult males, it could send a non-voting member to Congress and choose a territorial legislature (whose enactments had to be approved by the Congressionally-appointed governor). Once a territory had 60,000 free inhabitants, it could apply for admission as a state, with all the rights of the existing states.
The Northwest Ordinance guaranteed residents’ property rights as well as other rights such as trial by jury and freedom of religion. It also prohibited slavery in the Northwest Territory. The Ordinance also codified the involvement of the federal government in support of public education. Article 3 of the Ordinance set aside 1/16th of every township created in the Ordinance to be sold and the proceeds from that sale be set aside to support public schools. More tomorrow.
Suzie has criticized others when the the moist-recent comment column has been all one name or nearly all one name, so I have to point out that when I checked the site this morning, lo and behold, it’s NOTHING BUT suzie troll!!! Obsessed a little there, princess?
Dave,
That was a great post. Too bad we don’t have any statesmen around these days like Gerald Ford.
#35 This is the problem with right-wing black or whiters like Oliver. Her limited imagination won’t allow her to see this, but it IS possible to have something better than what the U.S. has but without the crapiness of Cuba. It’s not an either/or proposition. I wonder why there are other countries out there that da suze considers socialist but the people don’t live like pigs?
Of course suzie also sort of forgets to mention that your average Cuban lived like pig when private corporations ran and looted the place. That’s probably what toots wants to go back to.
Conversely,
I’ll just say I wish to hell you right wing extremists could get to live in the ultimate extension of the policies you want — Somalia. Government is non-existent there. You have to fend for yourself. If you want health care, pay for it. There’s no paying for your fellow down-on-their-luck citizens. If you want something, its up to you to take it. Of course, you have to watch out for those guys too, they’re pretty good at the whole Piracy thing. You know, that free-wheeling Anarchy which puts yourself first and to hell with everyone else? Well, at least the Somali people have been doing this for 20 years and got their annual average income up to $600. But thankfully for that 1%, because the lower 99% lives on leaves and fruits that grow in the wild. You go to Somalia, and you better have a bulletproof vest and some serious kung-fu skills. Oh and hey, there’s only one religion there, shared by 99.9% of the people. No more ideological differences to get in the way of progress.
The only difference between the Somali Warlords and your Tea Party Overlords is that Tea Party Overlords will lie to your face about caring for your needs. The Tea Party hasn’t begun their armed insurrection yet.
Please move there, right wing extremists*. It’s got everything you say you want.
*Right Wing Extremists is the proper word here. There is room for liberals and conservatives to work together, and there is room for Democrats and Republicans. But Extremists at both ends don’t get anything accomplished. Tea Partisans should not be referred to as Conservative nor Republican, but instead Fundamentalist Extremists. (Kind of like the 9/11 Hijackers)
Excellent post Dave! My father, a life-long Republican (much to my mother’s dismay), has had it with today’s Republican party. He says it began with the governorship of George Allen and intensified under Gilmore. He had never voted for a Democrat for president but campaigned for, and voted for President Obama. He says he didn’t leave the party – it left him.
First Suzie tells us all about how she emulates Jesus, and now she’s “wishing to hell” in post #35? I’d like to see the chapter and verse where He commanded/recommended doing that!
“rare bout of insomnia” = “no takers at the bar in Spikes”.
Right On Blacksburg Suz! One of my staunchest conservative friends has repeatedly admitted, “The Dems have done alright by Virginia”. There is not much higher praise to get.
Here ya go, Say What?.
http://bible.cc/luke/10-15.htm
Suzie, if you were any more full of it, you would be a zombie.
You obviously have no clue what “the ultimate extension of the policies” we want means, as they would bear no comparison to Cuba at all. You just confirm your ignorance and your petty partisan hate with such posts. No wonder you and pammala are such bosom buddies.
IF Obama was remotely a “socialist” he would be a hell of a lot more popular with the Socialists (and he is certainly not). Vapid sophistry is all you offer and then you have the gall to insult the intelligence and comments of others. You are a joke.
Good rebuttal Scott #40!
Marked Man (#40), I don’t see where Jesus was “wishing to hell” in that verse. The overall passage is about spreading the gospel and the consequences for those localities which rejected it (or the messengers). Capernaum in particular had witnessed many of Jesus’ miracles and still not repented and turned away from sin; in the corresponding verse in Matthew, Jesus indicated that if Sodom had witnessed the miracles Capernaum had, the people would have repented and they and the city would not have been destroyed.
Hey, Mark…haven’t seen you in a long while! I had some phone troubles over the winter (BB went bad, had to get a replacement, and then an Android) and lost the contact info I had for you, wanted to see how you’ve been and if you’d like to play a round sometime? I’ve played The Meadows a few times this year and have a much better feel for the place than I did the last time we played there…
Marked Man (Mark)
Welcome back! (I guess). . .
“Here ya go, Say What?.
http://bible.cc/luke/10-15.htm”
Say what? I say there are too friggin’ many versions of the same darn book. How many different ways does Jesus need to tell someone to go to hell?
” I’d like to see the chapter and verse where He commanded/recommended doing that!”
“You, Capernaum, who are exalted to heaven, will be brought down to Hades”
Jesus was clearly saying if they did not repent, then they are commanded to go to hell/Hades.
You asked for it. You got it. If you asked where He had ‘wished to Hell’, then that would have been more difficult to find as opposed to where He commanded or recommended it.
Why wouldn’t
1) “I wish to hell” that “x” would happen
v.
2) “I pray to heaven” that “y” would happen
be considered parallel appeals to one’s spiritual leader of choice — or their focus of reverence?
Well if you want to be technical about it, I think we are all well aware of the condemnation of the unrepentant. Say What asked where the Jesus she “emulates” advised her to “wish to Hell” about anything. Jesus never advised anyone to “wish to Hell” over anything they desired that I am aware of.
@53, Dave Hicks, they would be…to anyone looking at it logically. If a person prays to God, it’s pretty clear who their prayer is aimed at. Similarly, wishing to heaven…well, that is pretty clear too. Wishing to hell is an appeal to the dark side, whether it is intended as such or not. That’s why in every spiritual path I’ve experienced and learned from, they have all been adament about making sure that prayers, wishes, etc. are very clear and focused and have no vaguery or unintended language in them that could cause it to backfire.
As one example, a person might wish that they no longer have to work with an annoying co-worker. They may mean they hope they never get teamed up with that person again, or they may mean they hope they get a different job. But, that wish could also wind up being a vague invite for an accident to befall the co-worker so they can no longer work at all.
A wish to heaven would seem to appeal to a favorable or positive set of outcomes…a wish to hell would not. But that’s my take on it.
43
Kristen chimes in again. I believe she’s posted multiple times each and every day of her supposed “vacation”.
I’ll just say I wish to hell you right wing extremists could get to live in the ultimate extension of the policies you want — Somalia. Government is non-existent there.
That’s a laugh, pretending Somalia is “right-wing” with unlimited freedoms. It’s another African banana republic ruled by Communists, Islamic thugs and military strongmen. A model conservative country would be one in which people were protected through few but well-enforced laws. The closest we’ve seen is America prior to about 1913. That country became the #1 power in the world — just by letting the geniuses run wild with their creative forces. Edison, Ford, Rockefeller, Carnegie. The Wright Bros. Not punishing them. Not holding them back.
#57 Nice, suzie pines for the days of minors working in sweat shops and workers dying by the thousands in unsafe businesses.
Actually Suzie Q the U.S.A. was not the dominant world power economically or militarily until the end of WWII.
Suzie, we realize that the concept of friends is lost on you, but Kristen checking in with her friends on a blog she frequents, even while on vacation is not that big of a deal. Certainly not worth the effort you have put into it. Not that it is any of your business, but I doubt she is climbing Everest or spelunking in Sri Lanka. The internet is everywhere and many of us keep up no matter where we are. I am sorry that shocks your 50′s mentality.
#59 Please, Ron, don’t let facts cloud suzie’s fond fantasies about the days when small children worked all day in factories and coal miners died by the hundreds in mines.
Yeah Suzie, it is just a damn shame that nothing was invented and no new millionaires were made after 1913. We coulda been a contenda!
“The modern U.S. income tax was enacted in 1913, following ratification of the Sixteenth Amendment to the Constitution. For about 30 years thereafter,
until the advent of World War II, the tax applied only to high-income individuals. Exemptions from the tax were high, and few people had incomes large enough for even the lowest tax rate to apply, much less the higher, graduated rates. This all changed with World War II, when exemptions were sharply reduced and graduated tax rates for “regular tax” were sharply increased, the top rate, at one point, to 94 percent.”
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-soi/02inpetr.pdf
Yep, I don’t know how they survived much less thrived and made billions! Oh, the horror!
My interpretation of Suzie’s “wishing to hell” comment is “hoping or praying for something from Satan.” Obviously Jesus would never do that, nor would any devout Christian.
Actually, Somalia hasn’t had a central working government since 1991. Just a couple ex-military members trying to beg the rest of the world for assistance.
The State Department actually notes in their profile of Somalia that the country’s private enterprise has really helped the country out. Of course when your private enterprise involves beheading your competition because they are moving in on your turf.
Ahhh, Beautiful Somalia. No government regulations on corporations or utilities. No worries about people beating you down about your religion… Not a care in the world about global warming even though they’re on the coast of the ocean… The only worry there is when you’re going to run out of bullets, and how to get out into the water to hijack another boat.
Have fun with your fascist right wing pipe dreams! You’re taking us toward Somalia!
No government regulations on corporations or utilities.
LOL. There aren’t any ‘corporations’. It’s like saying Afghanistan has corporations. This is a banana republic, skippy. Everybody’s laughing at you.
Actually Suzie Q the U.S.A. was not the dominant world power economically or militarily until the end of WWII.
Jeez, is this National Moron Day or what?
So tell us, Ron. If the United States wasn’t the dominant economic or military world from say 1865 on, who was?
And now the leftwing nutballs won’t even let young teenagers work on family farms. Even kids who want to work can’t work. This is to prime them for 0bama’s welfare America. Take away the work ethic.
We see evidence of that thinking here. Take the Unitarian Universalist Chuch in Raleigh Court. A couple of years ago, a whole week went by after a snowfall. A whole neighborhood of teens sitting at home, yet the church’s sidewalks were still covered.
I doubt she is climbing Everest or spelunking in Sri Lanka
Really? No sh*t.
She at the WV mobile home of her b/f’s stepmom. They’ve been fishing for ten days now. Haven’t caught a one in the dried up creek, but the guys still plug away. Not exactly Mensa material we’re dealing with.
workers dying by the thousands in unsafe businesses.
Know what’s neat about private enterprise? You DON’T have to stay in a job you don’t like. Try that in a Communist Country.
And Screwzie continues her spiritual journey to become more like Christ……
In the late nineteenth and early twentieth century, you didn’t have to stay in a job you didn’t like—unless you wanted to eat. And from 1865
to the 1930′s, did you ever hear of the British Empire? You seem to know your history about as well as that noted historian with a B.A from UT, M. Howdyshell. But that’s our Suzie. If history doesn’t suit her opinion, she just rewrites it until it does. She must be one of the consultants for the Texas Board of Education.
#69 suzie, everybody on the blog is aware of how stupid this comment is when you’re talking about a time when so many unskilled jobs were dangerous. And they had to be done by somebody.
But at least it’s good to see you admit that you’re in favor of small children laboring all day in factories and in no safety rules.
So tell us, Ron. If the United States wasn’t the dominant economic or military world from say 1865 on, who was?
Comment by Suzie — July 12, 2012 @ 10:11 pm
Suzie Q, it is clear that as an engineering student (assuming you really do have a degree in engineering) you didn’t study history. After the close of the American Civil War, the U.S. largely disarmed except to maintain a force to subdue the Native Americans in the west. Only with the Spanish American War in 1898 did the U.S. really begin to engage militarily beyond North & South America. Teddy Roosevelt began the modernization of the American Navy to project “American Power” world wide. However, so did Great Britain, France and other European power. Not until the end of World War II was the U.S.A. the dominant world economic & military power. That was because World War II had destroyed the economic, and industrial base in the rest of the world. The war, except for Pearl Harbor, hadn’t touched U.S. territory and our agricultural and industrial base was intact. Only after WWII did the banking industry begin to shift it operational base from Europe to the U.S.A. The shift in power began in the early 20th Century but it wasn’t until after WWII when the U.S.A. was literally the last power still standing that the U.S.A. was dominant.
Re: Comment by Ron May — July 13, 2012 @ 7:45 am
“Only with the Spanish American War in 1898 did the U.S. really begin to engage militarily beyond North & South America.”
———
As a Marine, I can’t let that pass.
Check out the First Barbary War (1801–1805), also known as the Tripolitan War or the Barbary Coast War.
“Immediately prior to Jefferson’s inauguration in 1801, Congress passed naval legislation that, among other things, provided for six frigates that ‘shall be officered and manned as the President of the United States may direct.’ … In the event of a declaration of war on the United States by the Barbary powers, these ships were to ‘protect our commerce & chastise their insolence — by sinking, burning or destroying their ships & Vessels wherever you shall find them.’” Presidential War Powers — Thomas Woods
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Ron. I’ll ask again since you did not answer. After 1865, which country was a more dominant economic or world power than America?
This time, don’t spout a bunch of gobbledygook. Answer the question.
——
And from 1865
to the 1930′s, did you ever hear of the British Empire?
Yeah, we kicked their ass twice. Are you saying they surpassed us after the War of 1812? Please provide evidence of that. Of course, you won’t…….
After some investigation, looks like my hunch was correct within a decade or two. Certainly by the time the industrial revolution hit full stride by the 1880s, the United States was undoubtedly the world’s economic superpower. By 1913, our GDP was double the nearest competitor. That’s a far cry from Ron’s claim of 1945.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_regions_by_past_GDP_(PPP)
LOL. How many times must I say it: Libs should think twice before they challenge Suzie, lest they look foolish.
I believe Ron owes me an apology.
Wikipedia is reliable when Suzie quotes from it, but unreliable when anyone else does. Pshaw!
#67 most ill informed posted, “And now the leftwing nutballs won’t even let young teenagers work on family farms. Even kids who want to work can’t work.”
AGAIN WRONG. Do you ever know what you are talking about.
Answer – NO.
LABOR DEPARTMENT STATEMENT ON WITHDRAWAL OF PROPOSED RULE DEALING WITH CHILDREN WHO WORK IN AGRICULTURAL VOCATIONS Date: 04/26/2012
WASHINGTON — The U.S. Department of Labor today issued the following statement regarding the withdrawal of a proposed rule dealing with children who work in agricultural vocations:
“The Obama administration is firmly committed to promoting family farmers and respecting the rural way of life, especially the role that parents and other family members play in passing those traditions down through the generations. The Obama administration is also deeply committed to listening and responding to what Americans across the country have to say about proposed rules and regulations.
“As a result, the Department of Labor is announcing today THE WITHDRAWAL of the proposed rule dealing with children under the age of 16 who work in agricultural vocations.
http://www.dol.gov/whd/media/press/whdpressVB3.asp?pressdoc=national/20120426.xml
Please note the date – try to keep up “for Pete’s Sake”…
Exactly Shrillary. The leftwingers wanted to keep teens from doing good honest work. They were forced to reverse course only because of political considerations.
Since Wikipedia carries sway with Suzie: The British Empire: “At its height, it was the largest empire in history and, for over a century, was the foremost global power.[1] By 1922 the British Empire held sway over about 458 million people, one-fifth of the world’s population at the time.[2] The empire covered more than 33,700,000 km2 (13,012,000 sq mi), almost a quarter of the Earth’s total land area.[3][4] As a result, its political, linguistic and cultural legacy is widespread. At the peak of its power, it was often said that “the sun never sets on the British Empire” because its span across the globe ensured that the sun was always shining on at least one of its numerous territories.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Empire
The World Wars changed many situations and gave rise to the dominance and supremacy of America, But make no mistake Britain was a first and huge super power.
#79 – your welcome for the education and update – now we have to start working on your reasoning capabilities. That will be a long hard slog I fear.
U.S. population, 1913, 97.2 million.
British Empire population, 458 million.
How could anyone say the U.S was the greater superpower?
ummm, Dan, I’ll take a wild guess. Could the answer be, say someone tagged as ‘most ill-informed’?
Ding, ding, ding, we have a winner!
#75 Wow, you are so bad at history. The U.S. didn’t kick Britain’s ass in the War of 1812.
From Wikipedia, Suze’s new fave source:
“British losses in the war were about 1,600 killed in action and 3,679 wounded; 3,321 British died from disease. American losses were 2,260 killed in action and 4,505 wounded. While the number of Americans who died from disease is not known, it is estimated that about 15,000 died from all causes directly related to the war.[124] These figures do not include deaths among Canadian militia forces or losses among native tribes.
There have been no estimates of the cost of the American war to Britain, but it did add some £25 million to the national debt.[125] In the U.S., the cost was $105 million, about the same as the cost to Britain. The national debt rose from $45 million in 1812 to $127 million by the end of 1815, although by selling bonds and treasury notes at deep discounts—and often for irredeemable paper money due to the suspension of specie payment in 1814—the government received only $34 million worth of specie.[126][127]
Keep in mind that though it was the Americans who declared the war, pretty much ALL of it was fought over here or on the high seas. The Brits burned Washington; we never got near London.
Duh!
U.S. population, 1913, 97.2 million.
British Empire population, 458 million.
How could anyone say the U.S was the greater superpower?
Probably the same way the U.S. has a GDP 2.5 times that of China despite China having a billion more people.
LOL.
Wow. Dan is really peeved that I slapped Ron around and disproved his silly claim that America wasn’t the top economic power until 1945.
#86 Oh crap, Dan and I must be the same person now.
C’mon, Suzie. You’re not even trying anymore.
An (supposed) engineer trying to understand and interpret history is kind
of like a vulture capitalist like Mitt Romney trying to understand how every day people live. They just don’t get it and don’t have the capacity for it.
Obama gave a great speech tonight. And he connected with his audience in a way that Mitt Romney will never be able to do or even begin to understand. If the venue hadn’t been limited and tickets rationed, he could and would have drawn a much largwer crowd than the 3000 + who showed up and stood patiently waiting for nearly three hours. He will eat Romney alive in the debates because Romney comes across as completely plastic and fake. And for you guys who have chimed in ad nausem about teleprompters, where did you see one tonight?
730 delegates from all 44 Allied nations gathered at the Mount Washington Hotel in Bretton Woods, New Hampshire, United States, for the United Nations Monetary and Financial Conference. The delegates deliberated upon and signed the Bretton Woods Agreements during the first three weeks of July 1944.
In early 1945 Bernard Baruch described the spirit of Bretton Woods as: if we can “stop subsidization of labor and sweated competition in the export markets,” as well as prevent rebuilding of war machines, “oh boy, oh boy, what long term prosperity we will have.” The United States would therefore use its position of influence to reopen and control the world economy, so as to give unhindered access to all nations’ markets and materials.
Wartime devastation of Europe and East Asia
Furthermore, U.S. allies—economically exhausted by the war—accepted this leadership. They needed U.S. assistance to rebuild their domestic production and to finance their international trade; indeed, they needed it to survive.
It was after World War II that the U.S. dollar became the world’s reserve currency. Only then Suzie Q did the U.S.A. become the predominant economic power in the world.
An (supposed) engineer trying to understand and interpret history is kind
of like a vulture capitalist like Mitt Romney trying to understand how every day people live. They just don’t get it and don’t have the capacity for it.
You should be yapping at Ron, pardner. He’s the one who was wrong.
92
Keep digging when you’ve already been proven wrong, Ron. Do you think a bunch of copy and pasting of long-winded unrelated stuff will change that you were wrong?
Best apologize, put your head down, and move on.
Ron, of course, was and is totally correct. You, on the other hand, don’t know your keister from your elbow, especially as relates to history. You may as well give it up, because the more you post on this subject the more stupid you look. (if that is possible).
Ron, of course, was and is totally correct.
LOL@ the moron.
“Dammit, I am so pissed Suzie embarrassed Ron, so I’m going to claim black is white anyway. Proof be damned.”
I was correct and provided a link to prove it. America became the world’s preeminent economic power in the late 1800s coinciding with the industrial revolution. Liberal Ron was wrong, and tried to babble some unrelated stuff in order to divert.