Did Mitt Romney pay NO federal income taxes for 10 years?
Mitt Romney | AP
There’s been plenty of speculation as to why Mitt Romney has refused to release his back tax returns.
• Do they state he was CEO of Bain Capital after 1999, like Romney claims he was not?
• Do they show Romney participated in IRS amnesty for Swiss bank account tax evaders in 2009?
• Do they show Romney paid less, as a percentage of his income, than the average American bus driver going back years?
Romney has remained steadfast in his refusal to release the returns despite all of these questions.
He says he has released 2010′s return, and an incomplete return for 2011, and that is “more than the law requires.” (The law requires no income tax disclosure). Still, it’s far short of the standard set by his dad (12 years) when George Romney ran for president in 1968.
Now, Sen. Majority Leader Harry Reid has turned up the heat a few notches. He claims a Bain Capital insider has told him that Romney won’t release the returns because they show he paid NO federal income taxes for 10 years. But Reid won’t reveal the insider’s name, and he also says he’s not sure if the guy is right.
From Huffington Post:
Saying he had “no problem with somebody being really, really wealthy,” Reid sat up in his chair a bit before stirring the pot further. A month or so ago, he said, a person who had invested with Bain Capital called his office.
“Harry, he didn’t pay any taxes for 10 years,” Reid recounted the person as saying.
“He didn’t pay taxes for 10 years! Now, do I know that that’s true? Well, I’m not certain,” said Reid. “But obviously he can’t release those tax returns. How would it look?
“You guys have said his wealth is $250 million,” Reid went on. “Not a chance in the world. It’s a lot more than that. I mean, you do pretty well if you don’t pay taxes for 10 years when you’re making millions and millions of dollars.”
It’s one thing for a blogger or other pundit to speculate about Romney’s taxes, and quite another for the third-ranking Democrat in the U.S. government make such a charge. Even despite Reid’s apparent cageiness.
We’re now in, “Let’s make the bastard deny it” territory, the infamous game started by Lyndon Johnson, against senate opponent and farmer Coke Stevenson, when Johnson started the rumor the Stevenson slept with his barnyard sows.
It’s pretty dirty stuff. But if Romney doesn’t deny it, the question is only going to crop up more frequently. Reid, too, is going to get a lot of questions about who dished that info.
The question is, will Romney deny it? Or will he try to finesse his way around it? Will he respond that he paid “taxes” (read: not necessarily federal income taxes) every year? His campaign already has sad that.
Or will Romney do what he did with ABC news on Sunday, when they asked him if in prior years he paid less than the 13.9 percent rate he reported in 2010? He said he was “happy to go and look” and then his campaign has stiffed them on the question ever since.
Will he be “happy to go and look” and see if he paid any federal income taxes, then forget the question?
When are we going to see those Romney returns?
From the swing state polls it looks like it matters to voters.
August 1, 2012 - 5:24 PM
Now, Sen. Majority Leader Harry Reid has turned up the heat a few notches. He claims a Bain Capital insider has told him that Romney won’t release the returns because they show he paid NO federal income taxes for 10 years. But Reid won’t reveal the insider’s name, and he also says he’s not sure if the guy is right.
And this passes for journalism?
“A guy told me something somebody did, but I won’t say he is and I’m not sure he’s right”.
If there is to be a thread on this, it should be blasting Reid.
And all Mittens has to do is release his tax returns and put the matter to rest…but the release would evidently be worse than the pressure he’s getting from his own party and supporters…must have something to hide, no?
Is it really even POSSIBLE that he could have paid ZERO taxes? How is the man not in jail? Can you explain this from a legal standpoint? I need ammunition against all the morons supporting R-money.
“Somebody said….” has been Faux Spews’ stock in trade for years. It’s about time the Democrats started using it, too.
You know what someone told me the other day? They said “Katie, Harry Reid has three wives.” Now do I know that’s not true? Well I’m not certain.
Any by the way, that poll you cited over-sampled registered Democrats by 9%. I wouldn’t put too much faith in it.
So. . .Senator Reid provides unsubstantiated hearsay evidence that Romney, like about half of the citizens in the U.S., didn’t pay income taxes for ten years. The sheriff of Maricopa County, AZ recently advised the the birth certificate posted on the internet by Barack Obama is a fraud and provided numerous and specific evidence to substantiate the
claim. To Dan one of these items is news, the other not. While a columnist is not a journalist; they can most certainly be a hypocrite.
What territory is Mr. Obama in. . .or from?
Leon, no one gives a rip about the birth bagging nutters.
I see this as a somewhat fair analysis.
Reid basically says, I am just repeating a rumor and some in the “media” run with it. I would think “rational” people will come to a reasonable conclusion.
We have seen people repeat “rumors” about Obama does the “media” give the same response? I think we all know the answer to that…
When you have such a high ranking dem acting in this manner, I think there is a sign of desperation; or it may be that Reid is joining Pelosi in alzheimerville.
It must really be difficult for a fairly youthful president to have to count on these waning old farts to “cover his back (front and both sides)”.
I have yet to hear Obama pushers tout his “great” accomplishments, maybe they are holding these back for the “coupe de grace”.
Let’s face it… Obama is the best thing that ever happened to Jimmy Carter. Carter will no longer go down in history as the worst president of the USA.
If the desire is to be remembered, congratulations, move on and let our country move ahead.
OH,
I forgot the next press conference from Reid “when did Mitt stop beating his wife”?…
Katie@5 Anyone can search public records and discover if Harry Reid does or does not have several wives. Please tell me where I can research the tax returns of Rmoney? I’ll just wait for you to guide me to those records…tick, tock, tick, tock…
romney is a bum…..no way around it….if he wasny hiding something that is relevant he would release the returns…..he wont answer a question by newsmen…..he lies about obama….and he changes his position every time the wind blows another way
Leon @6 – you are about a year too late to discuss the “birth certificate non-issue” on this blog. Sorry you missed it. I’ll tell you the ending, and hope I won’t spoil this fantasy conspiracy story’s ending starring the teabaggers, Donald Trump and finally Joe Arpaio – the President released his birth certificate, HI released his birth record, the newspaper in HI showed how the announcement was archived in 1961. The End.
The discredited Maricopa County’s Sheriff Joe Arpaio. is trying to divert attention from his civil rights lawsuit by using the old and tired “birther” story.. .it obviously worked on you – too bad.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/16/opinion/sheriff-joe-on-trial.html
#9 mike o – the answer – when Mittens stopped lying…oh wait, he never stops lying.
Leon, (some advice)
Please do not confuse some of the lib’s on this blog with actual facts. Just use no name sources and innuendo which are much more believable to those who choose to wade thru life in huffingtonpostville.
Guess what else Willard doesn’t want to talk about. THE 2002 Salt Lake City Olympics under his direction:
“MITT ROMNEY OLYMPIC ARCHIVE STILL OFF-LIMITS”
“More than a decade has passed since Mitt Romney presided over the Winter Olympics in Salt Lake City, but the archival records from those games that were donated to the University of Utah to provide an unprecedented level of transparency about the historic event, remain off limits to the public. And some of the documents that may have shed the most light on Romney’s stewardship of the Games were likely destroyed by Salt Lake Olympic officials, ABC News has learned.”
“The fact that the documents remained behind closed doors also could be politically awkward for Romney, who has already faced criticism for his decisions to keep secret some of his past tax records and some details about his investment holdings. And it carries echoes of the decision in Massachusetts by Romney aides to purchase and erase their hard drives shortly before Romney left office as governor.”
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/mitt-romney-olympic-archive-off-limits/story?id=16811397#.UA1-EJHzYs7
Romney’s tax returns also showed he donated over 15% to his church and to other charities. How much do you give to charity and the church Harry Reid? Oh you don’t show anyone your tax returns. Oh yeah government knows better where to spend your money. Romney has showed all his tax returns that are required. Oh I forgot let us not talk about 15% real unemployment, 6 trillion dollars in new American debt, 48 million on food stamps, 1/6 of the population in poverty. Yeah I would worry about those tax returns of a man who worked and made his money legally.
James Swingle, Romney gave so much to “charity” because he’s a Mormon, and Mormons tithe.
Are you aware that Harry Reid is a Mormon? No? Well he is. . .
Btw, the tithing thingy is ANOTHER bit of speculation on why Romney doesn’t want to release his returns. Some believe he may have shorted the church.
Well Dan nobody took that 15% out of his check before he put his hands on it. And from my information he has always donated 15% or over. Not just like the Obama’s and start donating when the spotlight is on you. Speculation huh. Notice you don’t talk about 6,000,000,000,000 in new debt. No budget passed since the one has been President. Nice diversion Dan. Speculation????
More facts Dan, Harry Reid has been involved in some shady land deals too. Sorry us Teabaggers don’t speculate just deal in facts.
For a moment while reading comment #8 I thought I’d taken a wrong turn and ended up on the “Blog” of “Unnecessary” Quotation Marks (http://www.unnecessaryquotes.com/).
This will likely surprise some but, I don’t really care whether Mitt Romney paid any taxes for the last ten years. What I care about is the tax code that perhaps permitted him to do so. Many corporations also not only didn’t pay any federal income taxes they got billions in tax refunds, again because of the existing tax code. Mitt Romney wants to continue that tax code and expand its preference to the top 5 % and corporations. That’s what I get riled up about. We all should.
What Romney gave to the church was just another tax deduction for him.
Dan, question for you. Who do you intend to vote for this Fall, if you care to divulge that information. I am really curious about which way you are leaning? It would be easy to say that your leaning to the left and in Obama’s camp, but you may have another strategy here. With articles like this, I’d say you are actually opening the intellect of the left to transparent inspection, and that can only help the right this November.
By the way, since you are a fair and impartial journalist, why don’t you do a little piece on the 1st Lady’s expenses (fashion for instance and the cost of all of those nice clothes)? Let’s face it, Dems or Reps, they are ALL richer than most of us. Romney is wealthy, but so are the Kennedy’s and many other Dems. I would like to be as well and I will work for that goal (likely to never make it, but I will work for it).
Doesn’t Fox News or Limbaugh have a blog that some of the RWers would be happier on?
Leon #6, “hearsay evidence” is a legal term for a court of law to decide. Harry Reid “said he got the information from a former Bain investor. Reid also said Romney failed to make it through a Senate confirmation process as Cabinet nominee because of lack of openness about his personal finances“.
Read more: http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/329799#ixzz22Lukojm3
Sources, out here in the real world, (like bloggers) can remain anonymous, safe from any retribution. That in and of itself does not destroy their credibility nor that of the people who use their information. And if it does, what is your real name?
Oh yes, James Swingle #19, the folks who brought us the Clinton Chronicles are certainly strangers to anything but “facts”. Good grief what a laughable comment.
Romney has so much money, that a paycheck and what “comes out of it” is laughable too. Charity at his level is expected unless you are a true gold plated miser.
Not for nothing but 15% of hundreds of millions leaves you with a heck of a lot more money than 15% of 30K that is closer to the average American wage, in any economy.
A truly MUCH MORE relevant discussion than what Willard is hiding is what he plans to do to the working stiffs in this nation:
New Analysis Shows Romney Tax Plan Would Raise Taxes On Middle Class Families By More Than $2,000
Screw us and protect himself and his pals. Yeah, go ahead and vote for that plan!
Swingle, Do you realize that a majority of the new debt in the last three and a half years was virtually predestined to occur, because of debt service on the incurred debt of 2000-2006, and fixed spending on required commitments?
Like a low information spectator, you refer to the debt as if it has all been electively generated by the current executive branch. But you’re wrong. In a recessing economy, gov’t revenues fall, and debt financing necessarily increases. Such debt as was truly new was hardly truly elective, as much of it helped to stabilize the economy to prevent a depression level of economic collapse.
Tell us about your loud objections to the debt incurred during the shift from surplus to huge deficits in 2000-2006. Tell us all about your anger at those who created that debt. Tell us about that, then tell us about your feelings of those who used the Tax amnesty of 2010 to avoid prosecution for their tax avoidance by offshore account abuse. You do feel anger at those who shirked their tax responsibilities that way while you kept paying your fair share, don’t you? Tell us about how you deal in those facts, Swingle.
Kristen@7 and Shrillary@12. . .not so fast. On 6/28/12 a writ of certiorari was filed with the SC re: Weldon v Obama. The issue is
eligibility; not birth. Romney has done due diligence with regard
to the release of his tax information as, per Dan’s article, the law requires no release. Perhaps a reasonable trade would be approriate;
maybe another return for some college records or; even better; how Mr.
Obama happens to have a CT SS#. Sorry Mike O@14. . .I just assume they
can read if they can post. . .they just have to take the blinders off.
Warren, Mr. Swingle didn’t even realize that Harry Reid is a Mormon, otherwise he never would have trumpeted Romney’s “charity” by comparison.
Why would you expect him to understand the implications of the debt service you reference?
A person has to provide more tax return info to apply for a mortgage than Romney has provided in his application to be put in charge of the U.S. economy. Ridiculous.
Obama should release his college records because I hear he registered as a foreign student.
Dan where did I say that I didn’t know Scary Reid was not a Mormon? More speculation?? Seems like your speculation skills are farther off than your reporting skills. Warren I guess all the unemployment, food stamps and poverty were also predestined?? The spending of all the politicians who are bumming 40 cents of every dollar spent burns me up. Republican or Democrat. I know, I know everyone who doesn’t agree with this bunch is stupid. And Sandi we have all read your comments over time and understand well maybe not understand where you are coming from. Whew break out the tin foil hat.
It would be nice if we could “favorite” comments or “like” them. All y’all are just going back and forth spewing the same predictable BS, but Ron May’s comment (21) bears repeating:
“I don’t really care whether Mitt Romney paid any taxes for the last ten years. What I care about is the tax code that perhaps permitted him to do so. Many corporations also not only didn’t pay any federal income taxes they got billions in tax refunds, again because of the existing tax code. Mitt Romney wants to continue that tax code and expand its preference to the top 5 % and corporations. That’s what I get riled up about. We all should.”
Leon, re: Weldon V Obama (whoever the heck “Weldon” is)…I don’t care. No one cares. No one cared last election and so far it looks like no one cares this time either. If you seriously expect Rmoney to have a shot this fall, I suggest you take a new approach. I’d recommend one that actively makes your candidate more attractive as opposed to denigrating the opposition, but I acknowledge your challenges in that regard.
I hope Rmoney never releases those tax returns. The speculation on why he won’t is far better. I have no doubt that Rmoney employs the most creative and aggressive accountants…it wouldn’t be surprising if he HASN’T paid any taxes for a while. Gotta love a guy who can’t wait to send other people’s kids in harm’s way while not even paying them for their efforts. He’s the textbook RWer.
President Obama cannot run on his record NOR his liberal proggresive world view.(as evidenced by his back pedaling on his “from the heart” comments in Roanoke last month). SO, it’s back to the same ole same ole liberal, main stream media empowered, character assasination of the opponent. Let’s stick to the issues and try not to blame it on the former President please.
over 8% unemployment
16.7% African-American unemployment (highest in 27 years)
5 trillion dollars of new debt
dangerous failures in foriegn policy
nationalized healthcare
record numbers of people on food stamps and welfare
And the Mormon church spends its money on itself. It’s no “charity” and there’s no moral bonus points that accrue to Rmoney for handing over whatever he calculates is 10% of his income to it. Which, in Rmoney’s case, could well be 10% of nothing.
First of all, Harry Reid is not running for President. His State elected him and will either continue to elect him or not. Secondly, Mitt Romney could have easily avoided paying any US income tax with his offshore companies. That is the loophole Congress continues to allow the wealthy investment bankers. The fact that it is legal to take advantage of this loophole does not make a whole lot of difference to me. Mitt is running for the leader of our Nation and has been for more than eight years. If he did not have the sense, patriotism, and lack of greed to put his faith in our Nation and stop avoiding paying taxes by using aggressive loopholes then he obviously is a poor politician, leader, and cares nothing about public perception of our tax system. He simply believes he is above paying taxes and as such tells us all that we too should not pay taxes. Yet we know that does not work and in fact his economic plan will make the middle class pay more taxes while he and his investment bankers pay less. He wants to take away college tuition credits, he wants to take away the mortgage deduction, he wants to take away the medical deduction so seniors in nursing homes pay more taxes. Mitt shows that he believes only the ultra wealthy should pay no taxes and that the middle class should pay more. That is the point of his taking advantage of tax loopholes for the last ten years.
In spite of running for President during this hole period, Mitt could not bring himself to be a leader and show how he is paying his part of the Nations taxes. He could have easily brought his businesses back to the US and paid his fair share and shown what a patriot he is. Instead he shows us that wealth has its privileges and the rest of us should just kiss their asses.
One question Richard – Do you “take advantage” of any tax loopholes?
What about your clients?
37. will – When the GOP is running on anyone but Obama, then it is important to see who and what anyone might be. In the case of Mitt, there are some serious concerns of his ability to lead, his credentials, his honesty, his patriotism, his concern for the welfare of all citizens, his just plain likability. The GOP has indeed found someone as a nominee that is less Presidential than most anyone.
40. Will – neither I or my clients are running for President. If I were or if I was advising a client running for any office, I would advise them to do whatever it takes to gain the support and trust of the constituents. Taking advantage of loopholes by taking your business offshore does neither. For a person running for President for ten years this shows his greed outweighed his sense. Somehow that does not seem like presidential material.
Richard@38…if you said the same thing about Mr. Obama I would have to agree as he fails on all counts. This is the most corrupt, harmful and inept administration in history…and most of the story is being obscured.
While Dan seems to thing the tax issue will just get hotter for Romney, I
disagree. The focus will change as Fast and Furious gets to criminal charges, as the Green Energy fraud is exposed and as the White House security leaks make it plain that Mr. Obama will stoop to anything, sacrifice anyone or endanger our National Security to make him look palatable to voters.
Sandi@25…name is Leon and “hearsay” is not evidence in a court of law or
a legal term. What reason would prompt you to request specific identifying information on a blog poster? Planning identity theft, swatting or some other devious liberal harrassment tactic like kissing in
public at the local Chic-fil-a?
Richard could you provide the source your following statements:Yet we know that does not work and in fact his economic plan will make the middle class pay more taxes while he and his investment bankers pay less. He wants to take away college tuition credits, he wants to take away the mortgage deduction, he wants to take away the medical deduction so seniors in nursing homes pay more taxes. Mitt shows that he believes only the ultra wealthy should pay no taxes and that the middle class should pay more.
I don’t think you should talk about Romney’s experience of running something. What is Obama’s record of credentials? 168 days as Senator? Patriotism? Starting his career in the guy who was part of the Weather Underground? Others in this blog have attacked the Mormon church when Barack’s church he attended for 20 years preached some really incendiary things. Is this the Twilight Zone??
Good grief, Henry, are you really that stupid, or are you just being a troll?
http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/barackobama/a/obama_citizenship_questioned.htm
That’s just one reference. There are plenty more. This kind of nonsense is worse than the folks that said Ronald Wilson Reagan was the devil because each of his three names had six letters.
Comment by Kristen: Leon, re: Weldon V Obama (whoever the heck “Weldon” is)…I don’t care. No one cares.
Kristen…I am estatic over your apathy and sincerely hope it continues
straight on through till election day! However, Weldon v Obama could
bring this present terrible administration to a screeching halt.
Richard – In you humble opinion I’m sure. Now back to the question.
Do you “take advantage” of any tax loopholes?
What about your clients?
And if so – why is it ok for you to legally use the system to your advantage but wrong for Romney, or any other person for that matter, to do so?
Leon, the difference between Fast & Furious and the Mittster’s taxes is that the Obama administration has coughed up most of the documents. Mitt hasn’t. Yes, the administration asserted executive privilege over documents that had nothing to do with the F&F operations. So what? It’s the first time the Obama admin has asserted exec privilege. Bush did it 6 times in his administration. Clinton did it 14 times.
And Solyndra started under Bush, btw.
Leon,
Harry Reid came out with that charge knowing full well how provocative it is, and knowing that he would eventually have to give up the person who told him. But he also knew he would drag it out as long as possible for political advantage. (And fortunately, the Mittster is helping him!)
Richard – thanks for answering my question by not answering my question.
I think you missed your calling, you should have been a politician.
So it’s ok for some to use legal tax loop holes but not others.
“Richard – In you humble opinion I’m sure. Now back to the question.
Do you “take advantage” of any tax loopholes?
What about your clients?
And if so – why is it ok for you to legally use the system to your advantage but wrong for Romney, or any other person for that matter, to do so?”
Mitt can take will’s response and craft the PERFECT reply to his critics:
“I didn’t take advantage of any tax loophole that any of Richard J. Beason’s clients didn’t, and even though they’re not running for president you should vote for ME!”
That will go over well.
Just another instance of Pesident Obama’s transparent administration trying to break the law. From msnbc -
“The memo advised federal contractors — major defense firms among them — that they do not have to warn their employees about potential layoffs from the automatic, across-the-board budget cuts that kick in Jan. 2. A law, known as the WARN Act, says those notices would have to go out 60 days in advance, arriving in mailboxes four days before the Nov. 6 election”.
And another “transparent moment from our President from the 90 minute meeting with Russian President Dmitri Medvedev in Korea. ABC posted the transcript:
The exchange:
President Obama: On all these issues, but particularly missile defense, this, this can be solved but it’s important for him to give me space.
President Medvedev: Yeah, I understand. I understand your message about space. Space for you…
President Obama: This is my last election. After my election I have more flexibility.
President Medvedev: I understand. I will transmit this information to Vladimir.
Dan – Obviously Richard gave me the politian answer. So I’ll ask you. Do you take advantage of legal tax loopholes? And if so i ask again, in your opinion, is it ok for some to use legal tax loop holes but not others.
I wonder how many people who support the Roanoke Times by buying advertising use legal tax loop holes?
For that matter, do the owners of the Roanoke Times take advantage of legal tax loop holes?
People in glass houses ——–
“And another “transparent moment from our President from the 90 minute meeting with Russian President Dmitri Medvedev in Korea. ABC posted the transcript:
The exchange. . .”
will knows about this because of the entirely transparent nature of the exchange, of course.
What’s your point, will? That you wished Obama had whispered it in the cloakroom, so that you DIDN’T know about it? Are you arguing for transparency or not?
will, for me to answer that question, I would have to know what your definition of “legal tax loopholes” is.
If you are talking about child tax credits, a mortgage interest deduction, deductions for charitable donations and credits for college tuition, yes, I use those. I would have no problem if Romney used those to cut down his tax bill.
But I assure you, I am not in the position to use my wealth and influence to game the tax system like many who have wealth an influence have done. And Romney is.
So, tell yo what, will: if those 4 loopholes are the only ones Romney has used, I will publicly praise him on this blog for his patriotic taxpaying stance.
So now, let’s see his returns, so we can ensure he wasn’t benefiting from our great nation while paying NO taxes to it, or so we’ll know he wasn’t a tax crook who got amnesty in 2009, and so we’ll know he didn’t short his church on his much ballyhooed tithes.
So, let’s see the returns, will.
Oh, wait . . .
Yeah Will, like when obama promised transparency by televising EVERY discussion on obamacare… then 5 months after being elected, broken promise after broken promise.
#23 Comment by Devino — August 1, 2012 @ 10:28 pm
I am sure if you tried you could actually get more petty…oh, and I’ll help you…remember Nancy Reagan?
“…while First Lady, Nancy Reagan was the recipient of much conflicting criticism. Early in Ronald Reagan’s first term of office, Nancy Reagan was roundly criticized for her seemingly misplaced priorities — spending too much money on clothes and china and too little attention to social concerns.”
http://eightiesclub.tripod.com/id58.htm
Now let’s move on to important issues…
Dan – It’s not transparency if you admit to stealing cookies AFTER getting caught with your hand in the jar.
And so you admit LEGAL tax loop holes are ok for some and not for others.
Absolute double standard.
I have an idea, I think EVERY politician, on both sides of the aisle, should release their tax records for the last 10 years, begining with the President.
“But I assure you, I am not in the position to use my wealth and influence to game the tax system like many who have wealth an influence have done.”
Are you including the owners and clients of the Roanoke Times Dan?
Definition = legal tax loop hole – any tax exemption that is legal under the LAW. Imagine that.
Unlike the unlawful suppression of the WARN law the administration is trying to pull.
Maybe you should give Romney the same grace period for his tax returns you gave Obama for producing his birth certificate.
#47 Leon @30 and 47 – I don’t usually like to chase conspiracy theories and bogus coverups, but I would be happy to exchange information on these real “stories”…
1. Our government planned 9/11
2. Aliens landed at Roswell
3. JFK assassination by Johnson, CIA, Russians…
4. Princess Di was killed by the “Royals”
5. The Apollo moon landing was a hoax…oh yeah.
Why not go to a place where you can gather actual FACTS and where the lies you keep posting are DEBUNKED – that way you won’t seem so foolish:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/birthcertificate.asp
#37 Wow will, not only do you have the bible memorized, you have the Republican “talking points” down pat…quite an accomplishment [snark].
#45 James Swingle posted, “Richard could you provide the source your following statements:Yet we know that does not work and in fact his economic plan will make the middle class pay more taxes while he and his investment bankers pay less…”
I can help Richard out on the first about Romney not working. Would you believe Romney’s own words?
According to Willard himself: ‘I’m Also Unemployed’
” Mitt Romney sat at the head of the table at a coffee shop here on Thursday, listening to a group of unemployed Floridians explain the challenges of looking for work. When they finished, he weighed in with a predicament of his own.
“I should tell my story,” Mr. Romney said. “I’m also unemployed.”
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/06/16/romney-im-also-unemployed/
Hahaah – Willard made a joke – I wonder if the other “unemployed” made $42 million while laid off? and are they laughing with him?
will, how would I know if the owners of TRT have used their influence and wealth to game the tax system in their favor?
Either way, they’re not running for president, bub.
Dan,
Re: “if those 4 loopholes are the only ones Romney has used, I will publicly praise him on this blog”
OUCH,
What about those folk who do not have children, college, mortgage or charitable donations are they not paying more? does this make you unpatriotic, immoral in their eyes? (I don’t think so). You take full advantage of what you can. Should you disparage others for the same?
Does the excuse of “I am not running for (office)” alleviate us from those “responsibilities” that some preach so valiantly here? This sounds a bit close to class welfare arguments.
Will and James – in answer to your questions- The NY Times has an article on Mitt’s tax plan just today. You’ll have to look it up.
As for what I do for me and my clients, I suggest they take the legal (or grey area legal) based on their situations. If you are comfortable being audited and supporting your position, go for it if it can be supported. But you have to realize the costs of being audited. Lots of professional fees, lots of time, and if you are running for office bad publicity. Not a good idea if you are running for office. Personally I believe in taking very deduction you are entitled to. But legal deductions and loopholes cover a wide gray area. Mitt’s offshore accounts, trusts, overseas IRAs, gifts to his children, are all very aggressive and have many unanswered questions. For instance, Mitt has more in his foreign IRA than he could have legally invested and probably earned. He has yet to explain how he got that much there. Mitt does not reveal his earnings from Bain that are hidden in the offshore trusts, etc.
As for those of you that try to claim Obama is hiding things, show me. Obama has been vetted by Hillary and Karl Rove and neither could come up with anything. The GOP keeps trying, the Tea Party keeps trying, yet nada. Mitt, however, just keeps on giving and giving. What can I say.
Richard, nothing about Obama bugs you? Not all of his previous mentors who hate our country as founded. That doesn’t bug you?
Here you go James #45:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-01/surprise-romney-tax-plan-favors-the-rich.html
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-01/romney-s-tax-plan-too-detailed-and-too-vague.html
http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/UploadedPDF/1001628-Base-Broadening-Tax-Reform.pdf
65.will, how would I know if the owners of TRT have used their influence and wealth to game the tax system in their favor?
Either way, they’re not running for president, bub.
Comment by Dan Casey — August 2, 2012 @ 5:02 pm
Dan – so you do believe in a double standard. That’s all you had to say friend.
Suppose you found out they did, would you be critical of them?
And what about the clients of TRT who make it possible for you to earn a living? Would you hold them to the same standard and criticize them?
Here’s the record. Like I said, President Obama cannot run on his record so it’s back to the same ole same ole character assasination by the liberals.
8.3% unemployment up .1% from last month
16.7% African-American unemployment (highest in 27 years)
5 trillion dollars of new debt and growing by the minute http://www.usdebtclock.org/
dangerous failures in foriegn policy
nationalized healthcare
record numbers of people on food stamps and welfare
will, if the owners of TRT ran for president and refused to release 10 years of back tax returns, I would be critical of the. Of course.
And I would hold anyone to the same standard.
71. Dan – George Romney felt the same way.
68. James – even Christ had some bad friends. Does that bug you?
68. mike 0 – You seem to be missing the point – if you want to run for an office that requires the release of your tax returns, then you must be pretty stupid to have things in your tax returns that you do not want the voters to know. Its like getting a job with the Internal Revenue Service – you know when applying that they will be auditing your tax returns. Only a dimwit would apply if he has things to hide in his returns.
will,
Your frequent Tu Quoque attacks / fallacious arguments can be a very effective rhetorical device, when used in grade school — since the unsophisticated opponent is put on the defensive, and frequently feels compelled to defend against such attacks.
However, this is a classic Red Herring that adult thinkers ignore / discount — since whether (or not) the accuser is guilty of the same, or a similar, wrong is irrelevant to the truth of the original charge. If you accuse candidate “x” of being wrong in doing something, then your candidate “y” would also be wrong in doing the same, or something similar. Or conversely, if you believe that your candidate “y” is right in doing something, then candidate “x” would also be right in doing the same, or something similar. IOW, you loss points in either case. Tu Quoque attacks / fallacious arguments are non-starters in any logical debate — just rhetorical distractions and signs of weakness, in either your position of debating skills.
If you feel that the President Obama should make public information demanded by the opposition, then you are affirming that candidate Romney should make public information demanded by the opposition.
Why do some folk think that two wrongs add up to one right — or make one of those wrongs right?
Richard J. Beason,
For now, I would say the tax return standard applies only to presidential candidates. All of the major party nominees have followed it since ’68. (Not sure about Ross Perot).
It’s kind of funny. Mitt Romney is now carrying the torch for future multimillionaires who want to run for the White House while keeping their finances secret. It’s basically his chief campaign issue right now, whether he likes it or not.
Soon, he will be the patron saint of of the oligarchy. His dad must be rolling in his grave.
So you believe the POTUS should be held to a higher moral standard than other Americans.
That is of course unless it involves committing adultery in the white house with interns and that type of stuff.
Speaking of moral standards, Has Harry Reid named his source for the outlandish allegations against Mitt Romney?
I suppose lying is not on the radar as far as morality goes according to the liberal code of ethics. i.e lying under oath to a grand jury
Once again Obama cannot run on his record so it’s back to the same ole character assassination by the libs and their main stream media accomplices.
I agree Richard and I think you will find Mitt Romney is no dimwitt. I cannot wait for the presidential debates.
“So you believe the POTUS should be held to a higher moral standard than other Americans.
That is of course unless it involves committing adultery in the white house with interns and that type of stuff.
Speaking of moral standards, Has Harry Reid named his source for the outlandish allegations against Mitt Romney?
I suppose lying is not on the radar as far as morality goes according to the liberal code of ethics. i.e lying under oath to a grand jury
Once again Obama cannot run on his record so it’s back to the same ole character assassination by the libs and their main stream media accomplices.”
1. I believe Clinton should have resigned after he was caught lying about Monica. He didn’t, and the Republicans failed to throw him out. Most of them (the noncrazy ones) have moved on and so have I. Why haven’t you?
Note: this does not mean that I believe every man who ever lies, or cheats on his wife, should quit his job. So yes, I guess you could say I hold the leaders of our country to higher moral, intellectual and other standards. That was one of the reasons I was so critical of GWB.
2. If you have evidence Obama has cheated on his wife in the White House, bring it forth. Otherwise, close your pie hole.
3. Don’t you get it, will? Harry Reid WILL disclose his source, eventually. Or the source will come forward on his/her own. Or the allegations will be otherwise independently verified. Why is Reid holding back now? Because it prolongs the agony for Romney. This is a POLITICAL play, will. That is the whole point. I sincerely doubt Harry is lying. He’s a Mormon, too (and he’s a hell of lot less slippery that the Mittster).
@80 – Real Old Men of Washington DC. Awesome, the Country has turned into the Bravo Channel. Maybe we’ll get side confessionals of everything too.
Time will tell about Harry and his “source” Dan.
And whose higher moral standards are the leaders supposed to be held to?
Are you saying you believe in absolute truth? I thought relativism teaches that there is no absolute truth. So if there is no absolute truth by which to define morality, how can you hold anyone to a higher standard?
Where is the bar Dan and how do you know how high to place it?
And did you write that Bill Clinton should resign after lying under oath?
I do not remember reading that.
Once again Obama cannot run on his record so it’s back to the same ole character assassination by the libs and their main stream media accomplices.
2. If you have evidence Obama has cheated on his wife in the White House, bring it forth. Otherwise, close your pie hole.
Why should Will bring it forth evidence if Reid didn’t? You don’t make an accusation without proving it right at the time. But it’s no surprise a fake journalist makes lame excuses for Reid (“Reid doesn’t lie. He will prove it some time in the future”. Unbelievable.
Reid is among the most crooked politicians in Washington. To say he’s not “slippery’ is a joke.
will,
No will, I didn’t write it back then. I wasn’t writing back then. I was editing back then. The column, and this blog started in 2009, btw. Than was at least 10 years after the fiasco you’re talking about.
Now tell me will, did you write that Bill Clinton should resign after lying under oath? Because I don’t remember reading THAT.
Harry WILL disclose the name of his source. He’s merely dragging it out to inflict the maximum political damage he can on Romney. And it’s working.
I mean, Jeesh. What’s wrong with you people? This is political gamesmanship. I have explained this over and over. Can’t you read? How many times do I have to explain it?
That’s one of the differences between Reid and you, Suze. You will NEVER release proof that Barack has cheated because you don’t have it.
The other difference, of course, is Reid is the 4th ranking leader of this nation and you’re a sad, balding middle-aged dude who runs a car rental booth at Roanoke Regional Airport.
87. Dan – don’t you just love the way Suzie and Will tell us all the great things about Mitt and how much they love his wonderful personality, reliability, his wisdom, his charm, his honesty, and character. Oh, that’s right, they only say he is no worse than Harry Reid. Now that has to be a good reason to vote for him.
Personally, I have never put much stock in Mr. Reid and felt that he and Nancy Pelosi let the 2008 Congressional elections go to their heads. They thought they ruled the party instead of Obama. Water over the damn, but saying Mitt is no worse than Harry does not do much for Mitt.
The GOP should drop Mitt before the convention and seek someone with out all the baggage.
Harry WILL disclose the name of his source. He’s merely dragging it out to inflict the maximum political damage he can on Romney.
Reid has declined to disclose, nor has he said he will, and you have no idea if he will. If you were a real journalist instead of a party hack, you would demand he substantiate his claim.
What I want to know is when will 0bama resign for cheating on his wife.
“Reid has declined to disclose, nor has he said he will, and you have no idea if he will. If you were a real journalist instead of a party hack, you would demand he substantiate his claim.”
. . .Sez the lonely balding dude who works alone, rents cars cheap from a desk at the airport, and dreams of Republican victories. You kill me.
“I suppose lying is not on the radar as far as morality goes according to the liberal code of ethics. i.e lying under oath to a grand jury”
Careful, will. Screwzie explained to us in great detail awhile back how she could manipulate the truth to assure herself a seat on a jury, and since Screwzie is the Greatest Catholic Conservative Rightwinger in All the Land, lying must be an integral part of the conservative code of ethics. I guess that also makes Confession a piece of cake.
A friend of mine just told me Harry Reid is currently at the Bellagio with a prostitute. Harry does this every Friday, so says my friend. It’s a reliable source because I say so!!
#93 Bob,
Put down the crack pipe and get back to work.
A friend of mine just told me Harry Reid is currently at the Bellagio with a prostitute. Harry does this every Friday, so says my friend. It’s a reliable source because I say so!!
Bob, And if Dan were consistent, he’d print a thread based on your words and repeat them as fact. If anyone questioned it, Dan would simply say “Bob will provide proof later”.
“Bob, And if Dan were consistent, he’d print a thread based on your words and repeat them as fact. If anyone questioned it, Dan would simply say “Bob will provide proof later”.”
You’re darn right I’ll be consistent. When Rep. John Boehner, or Sen. Mitch McConnell, or someone of their stature alleges such a thing of Harry Reid, I will definitely do a thread on it.
Bob, you don’t fit that bill, and Suze doesn’t have the intellectual abilities to recognize that.
I fully appreciate that reality is hard for you right wingers, (one look at Romney proves your dilemma) but this delusional stuff is not making a point, it is making you look insane. Whatever “your word” and “your sources” say is pretty much said from the safety and protection of that anonymity you claim (for good reason). I would not want to be associated with your remarks either so I fully understand, but stop pretending you have or should have, the standing of the Senate Majority Leader or the ability to sway any sane person. Just to be clear, you have neither.
Suzie and others continue to not comment on the obvious — even if Rmoney paid SOME taxes, it was so little that he can’;t afford to release his returns. That much is perfectly clear.
Dobbs
Get Obama to release his college records and let’s put this accusation to rest.
(crickets, crickets)
It’s funny that Dan says the IRS is going after Romney for not paying his income taxes but can’t produce any proof of that accusation. I guess that is “journalism” these days.
As soon as Romney releases his tax returns, I will ask to see BOTH candidates college information Henry!
Why should Romney release his taxes? What does it have to do anything? You clowns don’t need to know. It’s none of your damn business since he didn’t break the law.
We want to know if the richest man ever to run for the White House paid federal income taxes, like every other candidate since 1968. And whether he illegally hid money in a Swiss bank, THEN got amnesty when it appeared the IRS might catch him.
Romney hasn’t answered either question. Is either too much to ask? No.
@95 Go Harry!!!
Dan,
Yes.
By now you are old enough for your wants not to hurt you.
Others of us would like to know if the corrupt clown occupying the oval
office is eligible to be President.
101. Romney’s father said he should release 12 years worth of returns. He does not have to release anything, just drop out and go away.
How about hearing Romney’s plan to fix everything?? We keep on hearing about Obama having some secret agenda… but nothing from Romney on his plan for fixing things.
Can Romney create jobs here? He sent a bunch to other countries. How will he bring them back?
#101 suzie must have access to Rmoney’s tax returns.
We want to know if the richest man ever to run for the White House paid federal income taxes, like every other candidate since 1968. And whether he illegally hid money in a Swiss bank, THEN got amnesty when it appeared the IRS might catch him.
Hmm. Not sure what Ross Perot did, but if he did something illegal, he surely would have been audited and caught. Derrrr.
Henry, I see you have the same grasp of the concept of irony as Suzie. You get Mitt to release his tax returns and put THAT issue to rest. I provided one link for you so here is another:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/occidental.asp
Sorry but I never heard a single cricket chirp. Just a parrot skwawking.
Maybe Mitt should bet Harry $10,000 dollars that he did pay taxes.
The responses from Dan Casey and the rest of the logic defying libs is proof that liberalism is a disease. There is no way you can have an IQ over 100 and truly believe and speak this nonsense.
The article linked below clearly identifies what is missing from the Reid/Romney debate over Mr. Romney’s federal income taxes.
http://www.nationalmemo.com/the-missing-evidence-in-romneys-tax-records/
And the rest of us want to know if the corrupt Wall Street fat cat clown running for the highest office in the land thinks he deserves more financial secrecy than any modern candidate before him. His privilege days are over.
Leon #44, I knew it would be over your head. My bad.
“Now tell me will, did you write that Bill Clinton should resign after lying under oath? Because I don’t remember reading THAT.”
Actually I believe it good ole slick Willie himself that said that, circa 1974. Not sure if he ever wrote it though.
“It’s basically his chief campaign issue right now, whether he likes it or not.”
Wrong. Liberals want it to be the chief campaign issue because they are absolutely desparate to keep the debate AWAY from the actual issues facing the country. They see Obama losing ground and know that if the elction is based on his performance instead of the demons they can create about the other guy, Obama has no chance.
hey gdad, Mitt paid more taxes in 1 year than you will have over your entire life. by the way, who gets to set the standard for releasing private tax records? i think it’s the same folks who sealed obama’s admissions papers to occidental and harvard, and the harvard law review…don’cha think?
RECORDS (College) for RETURNS. Has to be a fair trade…same number of letters, starts with “R” and multiple targets for each (Occidental=2007; Columbia=2008; Harvard=2009)…everybody gets what they want. Need more?
REASONS for RETURNS…surrender of law license(s), CT SS#, forged BC, forge selective service application…are we up to 12 yet? What say you
Richard and Dan? If they are running for the same office equal disclosure
is only appropriate!
Mitt Rmoney, show us your worth certificate!!
Frank, it was Mitt Romney’s own father who set the standard for releasing private tax records.