Who has the best lights in town? Vote now for your favorite in our holiday lights contest.
Birmingham, England | Andy Mabbett | Wikimedia Commons
“If you even dream of beating me you’d better wake up and apologize.”
View our commenting policy and standards | Commenting FAQ | Report a problem
Frank ‘n’ Leon,
Kindly read this and just shut the hell up at the dinner table so you don’t totally destroy the Holidays for your loved ones.
BTW, the rest of your families made fun of you after you went home last year. Try not to go there this year, k?
Holiday guide to arguing with your left wing liberal relatives. Thank God I don’t have any of those, but if I did, they wouldn’t be at my dinner table in the first place.
I know I’m way behind, but I was going through some of the other threads of the past few days yesterday. I read the comments on the Friday open thread, and found it to be not much different than the other threads, the topics have just changed a bit. I was struck, however, from one of the comments from Sandi near the end of the thread. Dan and Frank were going back and forth about Oswald and Hinkley and whether they were “left” or “right”. The comment that struck me by Sandi was #165:
Someone has to be mentally deranged and IMO evil to kill another human being (outside of the immediate passion of some trauma). To claim that a mentally deranged, evil or insane person is “left” or “right” is just some sickening partisan need you have to project. Unless he was like the man in Knoxville who talked of wanting to kill “liberals”, you have no basis for his being a “leftist” nor any concept IMO, what a “leftist” was or is.
I was wondering if Sandi would indulge my curiosity and see if I could expand on her first sentence. Would someone also be “mentally deranged” or “evil” if they didn’t actually “pull the trigger” so to speak, but was the one “in charge” of the killing? For example, someone like Jim Jones or maybe Dr. Jack Kevorkian, or even a gang leader that has people killed but doesn’t actually do the killing themselves.
Would you be willing to call these people “mentally deranged” and “evil” as well, or do they only get that if they are the ones actually “pulling the trigger” so to speak?
Curious on your opinion about the guy that administers the lethal injection shot as well, since he is in fact killing someone directly.
The guide was made for you Steve as a warning of what not to do! Funny how our impression of each other always seems to lean toward the whacky extremes too. I have a very good friend coming to dinner who does not share my political views but we still enjoy discussing current events without conflict or shouting. I think it was Churchill who said “If you’re not a liberal when you’re 25, you have no heart. If you’re not a conservative by the time you’re 35, you have no brain.” If you start on that premise, you’ll always leave upset as there are plenty of room for differing views; that’s what keeps it interesting!
Anyhoo- I’m gonna checkout for a couple of days on the politics to enjoy some good friends, good food, and some good spirits!
I’m thankful we live in the greatest country on earth and blogs like these prove we are a free people with individual thoughts and a beliefs that we are free to express.
Happy Thanksgiving to one and all!
Hey Folks, HAPPY THANKSGIVING to you and your families!
Below are links for Thanksgiving messages for you and your families.
The first is for all of us, and the second is from obama’s web-site, so it’s really just for those die-hard liberals among us.
Please enjoy Gearge Washington’s Thanksgiving Proclamation, which was the first Presidential Proclamation ever issued in our new country!
And now, from obama himself, through his nerver-ever-ending political campaign, now called Organizing for America?, I bring you the words and phrases he wants you use, to, in his mind, more easily open up discussions over the Holidays with your friends and family members who might be clueless about what do do about this obamacare thingy that people are in such a ruckess about!
Personally, I prefer Geaorge Washington’s message, and hope all of you will as well.
For those who choke on Washington’s words and wishes, here’s obama’s heart-felt suggestions for you to use, to save his butt:
I apologize for the couple of typos above…nevertheless, please enjoy the above links!
Happy Thanksgiving, Bill. I hope you enjoy the holiday with your more liberal and far smarter loved ones!
Happy Thanksgiving, Bill!
“Holiday guide to arguing with your left wing liberal relatives. Thank God I don’t have any of those, but if I did, they wouldn’t be at my dinner table in the first place.”
danny, why not? They’re still your relatives.
True story: A couple of summers ago, my mother-in-law, a Fox News devotee, wanted to discuss with me all of the ways Obama was single-handedly destroying the country. She felt the need to tell me raft of stuff that I “didn’t understand.”
I simply told her I loved her and that I wasn’t going to discuss it with her because no good could come from that conversation. So we changed the subject to the Catholic Church and bonded over its scandalous handling of its many and varied sex scandals.
There’s always some common ground you can find!
Jim Jones was definitely a leftist. Pretty much all the history of that church was a steady leftist progression, without any of the unusual deviations we know of along Oswald’s life path.
But Jones’ politics had little to do with the Jonestown massacre. By that time, he was crazy as a bedbug. And that had everything to do with why that took place.
A gang leader who orders a killing isn’t necessarily crazy. Sociopathic behavior isn’t necessarily characterized by derangement. But murderous sociopathic behavior is most definitely evil.
Thanks for the link to this hilarious guide. Unfortunately, in my family, it’s just a lot simpler to talk about the weather than mention politics. That “dirty” word is never mentioned at our big family gathering at Christmas. It’s like it doesn’t exist.
Dr. Jack Kevorkian, helped people who wanted to die due to terminal illnesses, or medical conditions that kept them in constant pain. He was not IMO a murderer.
I wasn’t so much worried about the right or left thing, but mostly the first sentence. Right or left doesn’t interest me much, but was just curious as to how far Sandi was willing to go with that statement. Thus I was just asking her to clarify. She just simply said anyone that could kill another human being was “mentally deranged” and “evil.”
Hope you have a good holiday and I’m sorry to hear about your brother.
My plan is to just be thankful for how great we ALL have it here in the the US of A. If talk drifts to the tyranny of a government that helps poor people or the tyranny of health insurance for all, I’ll just ask if they are thankful for where they are and how good they have it.
There’s just one problem. My cousin whose favorite topic is talking about Obama’s trying to take his guns away will be there. He’s the one that accidentally blew his index finger off when he was taking his pistol out of his holster after a night of conceal carry (he almost shot his wife in the gut in the process). That might be to much temptation for me to bear. I guess it would ruin the thanksgiving mood if I said I would thankful if Obama took HIS gun away from him…LOL
Hey Dan, according to you at post 10:
“A gang leader who orders a killing isn’t necessarily crazy. Sociopathic behavior isn’t necessarily characterized by derangement. But murderous sociopathic behavior is most definitely evil.”
What about the leader(s) of the terrorist gang known as the “Weathermen”?
Were those leaders simply tempermental young folks who had to suffer through their priviledged young lives with nagging mothers like oswald (oops, now HE wasn’t priviledged, was he?), or, were they terrorists?
Consequently, were The Weathermen leaders Bill Ayers, Bernadine Dohrn, and Kathy Boudin the “evil leaders” of a group which displayed “murderous sociopathic behavior” (which targeted innocent people and buildings for death and destruction), which in your words is “most definitely evil?”
I guess you’ll wordsmith and craft a way to explain away, and tacitly approve of, Ayers’ behavior as simply coming from a young malcontent who took longer to “find” himself than other mixed up kids from that era?
Verax, I think assisting in the ending of life for someone who wants to die is not killing in the same sense as ending the life of someone who does not want to die. I think Dr. Kevorkian and those who aid people who are suffering are heroes. I don’t think I could do it, but it should be available (within parameters) for the terminally ill who are suffering.
Outside of the context of war, ordering the taking of life is evil. And outside of the context of war, obeying such an order is evil.
Inside the context of war, I do not think evil or deranged is the impetus for killing, I think it is survival, and the protection of the mission or gaining of the intended ends and yet it still has the effect of a horrible breaking down of a psyche that asks people to do what we hope they would never consider otherwise.
Frank, President Obama’s website is WhiteHouse.gov
When the tree doesn’t fork, there is not much to disagree over.
Ayers and Dorhn engaged in no murderous sociopathic behavior that I’m aware of. Their group bombed a bunch of buildings — after issuing advance evacuation warnings. That’s not a defense of their actions — merely a fact that nobody was murdered in those bombings. You seem to want to have it the other way, for the purposes of your argument.
Three members of the Weather Underground blew themselves up making a bomb. That was an accident. There was no murderous intent.
The group disintegrated in 1973. In 1981, some former members, including Kathy Boudin, killed three people during a botched armored car robbery. That was murderous and sociopathic behavior (and it was evil) years later. But it had nothing to do with the Weather Underground movement, or Dorhn or Ayers.
Why don’t you mount some arguments in which you DON’T conflate and distort, Frank?
Thanks for replying Sandi.
I find the taking of any life, in whatever context, to be quite gruesome and sickening. War shouldn’t justify the taking of life (I understand self defense). Innocents in the midst of war die all the time, and I don’t find that just because there was a war going on, their murder to be justified. You can see how murky the waters can get, even within the context of war.
So I guess my next question would be: If a general ordered the bombing of a building in which he thought there to be “enemy combatants” and that building in fact does not contain “enemy combatants” but innocent people, is the general guilty of murder? the person dropping the bomb? the intelligence gathers? None of them?
I would also like you to answer the question I posed about the guy that administers the lethal injection. Does state sanctioning of a death rule out murder? What if the man was in fact innocent?
P.S. – As far as war goes, if politicians want to wage them, they can go fight them themselves. But this is just my opinion. I find war itself to be quite evil.
Organizing for America is obama’s political organizing offshoot from his reelection campaign committee. Duh!
Can’t you even do “connect the dot” excersizes any more? Oh. I just got it. You don’t want to play that game, because the dots lead you straight to obama!
Don’t forsake him, Sandi. He needs you now more than ever.
Please read what he wants you to do over the holidays, beginning with Thanksgiving, and jump on board his wagon! Hi Ho Silver! Away!!
Mother-in-law,s rules for family dinner.
Suitable topics of conversation:
health of non-attending relatives
Va. Tech football
Topics NOT suitable
anything about UVA
During her life we had many wonderful family dinners.
Everyone enjoyed themselves and there were no arguments
Sure there were differing opinions but people across the spectrum were able to enjoy wonderful meals and the company of relatives.
Obama, “I pardon this turkey…..Period.” Not good news for that bird:)!
You know, I agree with your statement, “Three members of the Weather Underground blew themselves up making a bomb. That was an accident. There was no murderous intent.”…except for the last part!
Of course the commrades of Ayers and Dorhn who accidently blew themselves up in Grenwich Village didn’t intend to murder …themselves…, did they? So, you are right, they had “no murderous intent” to blow …themselves… into little bits.
Here’s the …but…, Dan. But what was the bumbling nail-bomb makers’ …intent… with making a …nail-filled… bomb, in the first place?
It was to kill and maim soldiers at Fort Dix, and students at Columbia University. Thankfully for the innocents, the only folks hurt by those bombs perished of their own making. They died a horrible death, at their own hands. Their blood is on Ayers’ weathermen organization.
Were the activites of the three Ayers associates who bungled their nail-bomb making job and blew …themselves… up, instead of their intended targets, in your words, “murderous and sociopathic behavior (and it was evil)”, Dan? Was their intent evil? Evil was unleashed on them, wasn’t it?
What other purpose is there in making a nail-bomb, but to unleash evil?
All this did was cause Ayers to go further underground.
Then, he ends up helping to launch obama’s political career.
On a more cheerful note, anyone out in the blogosphere have a good brew they will be drinking with their Thanksgiving fest tomorrow? I’m thinking about popping open a homebrew me and a friend of mine did: a “bourbon barrel” stout (it was really just bourbon soaked wood chips added during fermentation). It was fun to make, so hopefully it will be fun to drink!
How about the rest of the you, anything special?
Good suggestions, Rob Thommins.
We do have the occasional spat about VT and UVA football, but tomorrow I suspect all parties will be silent on that one!
Verax, we’re opening a cider from Blue Bee Cider in Richmond. We did a tasting there last weekend and it was (if you like hard cider) delicious.
Ron Tommins, your MIL had good sense.
Happy Thanksgiving and Happy Hanukkah everyone!
Verax | November 27, 2013 at 1:29 pm,
I cannot find that “the taking of any life, in whatever context, to be quite gruesome and sickening”. Having seen people I love suffer physically and psychologically, I think there are circumstances where the “taking of life” is a kindness and a release from suffering.
I did not say that war can “justify the taking of life”. It is a fact of mankind that I did not invent and unilateral disarmament does not bode well for any of us.
I also did not say that war “justified” the deaths (purposeful, inadvertent or purely by accident) of innocents. I would not say that, but again, war is not my invention nor mine to control. War is a hideous perversion of what we want to be. “Murky” does not begin to describe it.
In general, the adjudication of guilt is based on a criminal charge. In war that may fail to happen, but certainly all participants are “guilty” of whatever atrocity happens on some level. Making a mistake is not the same as deliberately choosing to murder innocent people caught in a war zone.
IMO “the guy that administers the lethal injection”, is merely a tool of our justice system as opposed to someone who made a conscious decision for the person to die and therefore has no guilt regardless of the guilt or innocence of the person they are injecting.
I agree that politicians, warlords and ayatollahs should fight their own wars.
Name is required
A valid email is required (email@example.com)
Comment is required
Your email address will not be published.All fields are required to comment.
Wed, 18 Dec 2013 14:06:31 +0000
Metro Columnist Dan Casey knows a little bit about a lot of things but not a heck of a lot about most things. That doesn't keep him from writing about them, however. So keep him honest!
He welcomes your rants, raves and considered opinions, so long as the language is civil (i.e. no four-letter words). He'll read all your posts and may or may not respond.