2012.03.05
Let’s talk comments
This post is from Stephanie Ogilvie, dayside delivery editor and leader of the engagement team for the redesign of roanoke.com.
One of the big questions we’ve been tackling at the start of our website redesign is commenting, which is part of our bigger company discussion about engagement in general.
When our engagement team gets together to address the commenting issue, we keep hearing similar metaphors: That we liken our role to that of a dinner party host. And we aim to provide a cordial, safe place to chat, like a front porch.
We want to offer a forum to readers — and to allow anonymous comments, as we do now — but still moderate for civility. We’re also considering including comments from your Facebook and Twitter accounts, where you’re already talking to your friends.
Besides the conversations happening on our numerous blogs, we’re looking at different ways to incorporate your voice — and to host conversations about what’s going on across our valleys.
We’ve done that in the past, using the technology that was around at the time — Remember our Forums section? — but we’d like to take advantage of what’s around now, and create the kind of space that best accomplishes the “front porch” feel.
That doesn’t have to mean comments at the bottom of every story. Perhaps we should consider an open, daily forum for discussion that might be organized by topic or story? Similar to The Atlantic’s Open Wire or the Atlanta Journal-Constitution’s Vent, suggested previously on this blog.
These days, most of the discussion on our site happens on our blogs, where communities have formed around everything from the nuances of weather to shopping for the best deals around town to anything and everything about Virginia Tech football. Comments are moderated by individual bloggers, and folks in each of those communities have, more than once, told us they like the idea of chatting with each other in a place that feels congenial and respectful and rich with ideas — even when they find themselves disagreeing with each other. Another bonus: Folks don’t have to log in to comment.
It hasn’t always been that way.
You might recall that, a few years ago, we tried out a forums tool that allowed readers to respond to a question or discussion topic unfettered, without moderation or flagging by other users, and despite our best efforts, it didn’t gain much traction. Registration was required to add your two cents. It could get a little unwieldy or confusing at times. On its best days, though, it gave our readers a space to discuss and debate and connect with each other over the most pressing issues in our communities. Some folks loved it and used it all the time, most stopped by to check it out and didn’t come back — and some bots loved to troll it.
But that’s why we’re trying this again — fresh — with our redesigned site.
And we’d love some input as we continue our discussions. Here are some questions to get you started:
1. What do you like/not like on other websites that allow comments?
2. If given the choice, would you post anonymous comments? Or use your Facebook/Twitter account to share your thoughts? Why?
3. What other ways would you like to engage with us? For example, would you participate in live chats with reporters/editors/photographers on particular stories? Any other ideas?
For me, comments only work when they are set up as on this page: you scroll down to the bottom of the story and Leave a comment. Having to go to another section of the Website, or needing to register, would be a deal breaker for me.
I would never, ever sign in with a FB account, but I’ve seen that on other paper sites.
Be prepared to invest significant time into moderating/removing comments though; not only can people become uncivil, but spammers love love love to hit blog comments with their junk.
Thanks for asking for input!
Comment by Catherine — March 5, 2012 @ 9:46 am
I generally like the current format. I’d like to see a system where a person has to register on the site for an account in order to post…that would eliminate a lot of the spam, and the trolling. It would still allow for anonimity though, since users could still pick a screen name of their choice.
One thing that has led to me cutting back significantly on my commenting and viewing of the site are the inflamatory comments and general lack of civility of some posters, primarily on a handful of political-oriented blogs. They are essentially let to say whatever they want, so long as they put an * or # in the place of a letter or 2 of swear words or other vile insults.
I have no use for that sort of stuff, and I’ve eliminated several blogs from my routine of viewing and following as a result, and basically limited my visitation of the site to sports, weather, and food.
And, if it wound up being that a FB account was used/linked for the comments, I’d be gone completely.
Comment by Other John — March 5, 2012 @ 11:46 am
Hey all, this is Dana with the RefreshRT team, I’d like to comment on this post as a user not as a moderator.
I rarely comment on stories, but I love to read the comments. I don’t think every story is something people want to comment on, but I think there are a lot more than are currently available. For instance, I would have loved to see a discussion around the story of the Lord Botetourt teacher who was charged with assault and is now being sued.
It’d be nice to have a place for people to either start a thread or suggest a topic.
Comment by Dana Bailey — March 5, 2012 @ 12:13 pm
I like the current comment system (the way it looks) though, I believe the method of previewing comments before publishing them is problematic. I think people should be held accountable for what they post. If they violate the terms of service by posting horrible responses, they should be banned from posting.
To do so, for sure, 1000% there needs to be a login system for commenting.
I would kind of like to see Facebook’s login as the login system, that way people would be less likely to be acerbic and angry with their posts the way anonymity affords them. This may actually allow people to “ignore” other users if they have them as blocked on facebook. (A very good feature for some of the political message boards here.)
Another feature I like used throughout the web on blogs is a thumbs up/thumbs down feature. If you like what someone says, you thumb it up. if you don’t you thumb it down. The more thumbs down it gets, the more faded the text is until its almost invisible.
There just has to be a way for the community to enforce its own standards rather than relying on interns or columnists to sit there and read and approve every message.
Comment by scott — March 5, 2012 @ 12:36 pm
I agree with Catherine, I only frequent the Storefront and Kevin Myatt’s Weather Journal just because that is all that interests me, but I feel like having to register and log in to post comments would significantly decrease activity. I like the fact that you can post anonymously, and I personally have no problem with the Captcha Code if it does help reducing spam. I like the current system but having to log in to comment would probably deter me from doing so.
Comment by Roa10 — March 5, 2012 @ 1:45 pm
I agree with Other John.
I think having a registered account is a good idea. As someone who does this sort of thing for work, I think it would be easier for the RT to monitor the sandbox if they don’t have to bother with spam comments or people always posting “you suck” or other such useless information. I am not a fan of moderating a comment first. That leaves open complaints from the total wackos out there that their deleted post about the 9/11 conspiracy is a conspiracy. KWIM?
If people want to log in with Facebook, that’s cool. I will not though.
Comment by Lisa — March 5, 2012 @ 3:16 pm
I very much think a social plugin is the way to go, include Facebook & Twitter since its easy, but also, services like Disqus are pretty great as well and can be integrated with Facebook, Twitter and the like if the person so desires.
Comment by Zach — March 5, 2012 @ 3:19 pm
I too agree with Catherine.
Too much bother with signing up/in or membership etc. would turn too many off and limit your input. But the occasional ranter and foul-mouth will have to be monitored.
This is a good system. Keep it up.
Comment by Rucker — March 5, 2012 @ 3:29 pm
Since there is not a thumbs up, I’m stating for the record that I like Zach’s comment. Modern commenting software (or plugins) can solve a majority of the SPAM and defamatory commenting problems with features like user blacklists, moderation by keyword filtering, and community moderation via flagging or other means.
Commenting at the bottom of posts (or stories) is the only realistic solution for the majority of content. It’s the industry standard, and it’s where readers expect to find commenting, when available. Though, there may be certain circumstances where a community thread for a series of stories, or on specific topics may also work well, this solution should be viewed as supplemental, not a replacement of traditional, below post commenting.
Comment by Phil Woods — March 5, 2012 @ 4:03 pm
I would love to have the option to comment on stories, not just blog entries. For example, I loved Lindsay Nair’s article on the Read Across America Day. But in order to share my thoughts, I emailed Lindsay because there was no comment feature on the “feature” story. I’d rather not have ANOTHER log in, and I really don’t like Facebook “tracking” everything I say. I would prefer the moderated comments we see now to either of those options.
Comment by Fincastle Mom — March 5, 2012 @ 4:34 pm
This is Dana with the RefreshRT Team, thank you to everyone who has commented today. I’ve enjoyed reading everyone’s suggestions. Please keep them coming!
Comment by Dana Bailey — March 5, 2012 @ 5:12 pm
If I have to use a Facebook or Twitter account, I wouldn’t comment. I don’t do apps…that’s why I don’t “do” Pinterest, BranchOut, Klout, and the million other “requests” I get that require access to my FB account.
Comment by Elena — March 5, 2012 @ 6:32 pm
In my opinion, privacy in the digital age is largely an illusion, therefore I don’t write on the web with the expectation of remaining anonymous. I always pause and consider my words before hitting the “Enter” key. Accountability for one’s words, often reduces the need for a Moderator.
I would feel comfortable signing in with Facebook.
Comment by Wayne Sowder — March 5, 2012 @ 7:45 pm
I like the way Yahoo does it, with the ability to thumbs up, or thumbs down. Privacy to comments a must
Comment by Gretchen — March 5, 2012 @ 9:30 pm
I agree with Other John. I have no use for hate spitters. What ever happened to having manners?
Comment by Sam Miller — March 5, 2012 @ 10:24 pm
I’m of two minds. On the one hand, I appreciate that comment moderation can keep the most inflammatory comments out of public view. On the other hand, it’s frustrating and detrimental to encouraging conversation when I post a comment on Friday and have to wait until Monday for it to show up (this happens most frequently on the Back Cover blog), so it would be nice to have a registration/login system in place that would make it possible to bypass that wait.
While I’m in favor of allowing Facebook and Twitter comments to be included in the conversation, if Facebook registration becomes mandatory for commenting at all then I’m gone. I’ve dropped half a dozen sites from my daily reading in the past year for doing this.
One thing I would like to see, if it can be done, is comment threading, so I can reply directly to a comment and have it nested beneath the parent, rather than have to include “Other John @11:46,” for example. It would also be nice to get e-mail notification of replies to my comments or even to be able to subscribe to a particular post rather than having to hit refresh repeatedly to see new comments.
Comment by Laura — March 6, 2012 @ 8:52 am
I like the way it is now. Most of us have valuable opinions, but some of us can’t always say who we are… especially those of us who work in the media.
I’d also like a place to leave comments on stories and not just blogs. Sometimes I’ll leave a comment, sometimes I’ll ask a question for clarification. The important thing is that I get a response if I ask a question.
Comment by Babs — March 6, 2012 @ 8:57 am
I too agree with Other John. Couldn’t have said it better.
Comment by Huntersdad — March 6, 2012 @ 9:38 am
I’ll say this much…the blogs I frequent are basically The Weather Journal, Fridge Magnet, Aaron McFarling, and the Happy Wag. Every so often I’ll look at another one, but those 4 are the ones I enjoy the most and comment on the most now, because the blog owners are interactive with the comments/commenters on a regular basis, and the overall atmosphere in those blogs is pleasant and enjoyable. Some of the blogs I used to frequent more regularly in the past, such as the Roundtable or Dan Casey, I’ve largely given up on because of either the absence of interaction of the moderators (RT…used to be very active, now the moderators seldom seem to chime in, but they moderate the heck out of comments), or the lack of moderation (Casey…very interactive but anything flies).
I absolutely stand by that if a facebook or other account is required to comment, that I won’t be commenting again. There’s a number of folks here who know me in person, and some of them are also on my FB, but by and large I prefer keeping the two separate, even though I don’t have much personal information up on my FB page aside from my name and a couple pictures.
The comment threading I’ve found to be difficult to follow …if there a way to have the user select how they wish to view comments so they can be displayed in the threading format with replaies to particular comments attached to the original comment, or chronologically for people who like that format…I’d be favorable of that change. Because, sometimes, it is nice to see what comments someone is replaying to, without having to see the name/numer/time and scroll through the old comments to find it.
I know some people are sticklers about chiding the anonymous commenters for not using their whole name, but there’s times when that is necessary. I don’t want my name popping up with a few pages of RT comments if someone does a Google search, used to be a bunch of entries on the old forums would appear. I don’t want or need that, given what I do for a living. The last thing i want is for someone to be doing a background check and have the top entries come back as my thoughts on the last VT basketball game, or a story about one of my cats.
Comment by Other John — March 6, 2012 @ 10:00 am
Please just leave well enough alone. Its good just like it is.
Facebook ???? Not for me, never has been, never will be.
Comment by Sammy snowman — March 6, 2012 @ 10:04 am
I only post on K. Myatts weather blog. However, there are a lot of farmers and gardeners there too and a gardening subject or tip isn’t always appropriate. Either set up a gaedening blog or something similsr and DO moderate it. Thanks.
Comment by wdbrand — March 6, 2012 @ 10:11 am
This is Dana with the RefreshRT team.
Other John, you mentioned liking blogs with interactive moderators, one of the things we’ve talked about with this blog is how best to interact with the commenters. Obviously, like Babs said, if someone asks a direct question we should reply with an answer, but some of the other times aren’t quite so clear. Do you have any suggestions as to what feels natural? Is there ever a time where the moderator can comment too much?
Comment by Dana Bailey — March 6, 2012 @ 10:29 am
I like it as it is now. And I agree with Other John. I have totally given up reading Dan Casey’s blog because of the same 20 people hating on each other every day.
Love Kevin’s weather blog and Amanda’s $torefront.
Comment by WDog — March 6, 2012 @ 10:31 am
I prefer the current format. I don’t want my facebook or twitter account connected and if that were to be what happened, I probably would no longer be commenting. Like Other John, I frequent the Weather Blog and the food blogs regularly. I do not enjoy the political blog at all because of the vile language and what I perceive to be lack of moderation. It lacks civility and it isn’t something I enjoy. Kevin Myatt’s blog on the other hand is civil and very informative. He is is very interactive and quick to answer questions which makes the blog enjoyable. Also, like wdbrand said, there are many gardeners and bird enthusiasts that frequent the weather blog. I would love to see a blog started for that purpose.
Comment by Shanon "Nurse Snow" — March 6, 2012 @ 10:43 am
I chat with Other John on Aaron’s blog all the time. I like that format. I find it invigorating as I work from my home and miss the “water cooler” contact I had with people when I worked in an open plan office. I particularly enhoy the sports blogs because I am a Hokie transplantes to Texas. I participoated in the RT sports blogs while in Arizona and my VT fan son, who lives in Europe, can engage as well. This is a major step up from the days before the net. I really enjoy this activity because I get to “talk Tech” with fans I would otherwise never meet.
I dislike complicated sign in procedures and would not log-in through facebook. I do believe people should be accountable for their comments and that unidentified contributors encourages incivility. I used to post under my real name but decided that a blog-name was a better idea. The RT has access to my email in case I go over the top.
Comment by Zman — March 6, 2012 @ 10:58 am
I love Roanoke.com and I am here daily. I do not blog or comment anonymously but I fully appreciate that some folks want and deserve that option. I believe that the only way to have a civil site and less work for the moderators is to have a registration process, verified email and address with the site. This is a one time thing and allows you access to all of the site content and commenting forums. The reason so many blogs get too rowdy is that people are not known and held accountable for their posts.
I like the idea of allowing other apps FB, Twitter, etc to sign in as an option but do not think it should be required.
I think that comments should be allowed with news stories as well as blog threads.
I love Laura’s idea of being able to nest comments and have an actual conversation as opposed to searching back and forth for the post # or time.
I wish that in Google Chrome the post numbers all showed up outside of the avatar boxes. I love the avatar boxes though and hope you can keep them.
I hope that more moderators will join in the conversation, but I also hope that offensive people who are complained about or who cause severe problems in a discussion will be banned. It is “free speech” after a fashion, but it serves no purpose in fostering dialog and community. The mindless, hate filled rants and insults traded are demeaning to the blog and expecting people not to “fight back” is unrealistic. Just remove the problem. More people appreciate being able to offer their opinion when they do not think they will be attacked. I have had many people tell me that is the reason they do not comment. If you are not going to fix that problem, your efforts will remain stymied
I think you should have a suggestions page for people to suggest or share stories that might not make the newspaper but are worth hearing.
I think you should have guest bloggers that people can ask questions and get answers back from on certain topics. If someone is popular, give them a blog.
And most of all, I would give a lot not to have to deal with the Captcha Code!
Thanks for asking!
Comment by Sandi Saunders — March 6, 2012 @ 11:34 am
I believe an active moderator who participates and interacts makes for a much better blog.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — March 6, 2012 @ 11:36 am
I only post on the weather blog. I think it works very well the way that it is set up and I would hate to see it change. If you link it to facebook or twitter, I will be gone. I don’t do facebook and I don’t do twitter! I would also not use a site where I had to log in. Please leave well enough alone. Trying to “new and improve” something that already works very well only ruins it!
Comment by Leo Lady — March 6, 2012 @ 12:22 pm
Anonymity as long has the tone is respectful of others. An interactive moderator like Dan Casey makes for lively discussion even if opinions do tend to be strong. Just tighten up the community standards and we are good to go. I could see posts being automatically posted real time for discussion purposes but should be taken down if blog standards and civility are not held.
Comment by Cold n P — March 6, 2012 @ 12:40 pm
Dana, I really enjoy the moderators participation. The RT blog was, in my opinion, much better when Christian, Dan Radmacher, Luanne, and others were regularly chiming in and responding to questions posed by the commenters. For whatever reason, after Radmacher left, that seemed to slow down tremendously, and few questions seem to be answered. Most of the time I see one of them repsonding, it’s to break up discussion that is veering off topic, or that is getting too heated and/or personal.
Like Sandi Saunders says, the active moderator makes for a much better blog. That’s why I like the blogs that I do, and I also did forget the Storefront and Shoptimist, since I do chime in there from time to time.
I like the current format a lot, though for whatever reason, some browsers don’t display the formatting properly with avatars over the comment numbers, which makes referencing old comments hard to decipher. I don;t mind the ‘@ Other John/#19′ sort of referencing that most people do, because when the numbers are visible, it’s easy enough to follow. I suppose this is where the threading on/off feature could be helpful.
As for a log-in feature…I believe that could be integrated with the current roanoke.com log-in, which allows users to use the forums or things like the Fearless Forecasters football picks. Log-in once at the main site or when submitting an initial comment, and leave the user logged in until they clear their browser cache (like how the blogs currently store screen name and e-mail until cache is cleared). That way the lpg-in is not complicated or burdensome at all…provided it can be tied to the roanoke.com site login and a screen name can be selected, rather than using a Facebook account (unless the FB personal information can be blocked from appearing to other commenters via an anonymous and unlinked screen name.).
Comment by Other John — March 6, 2012 @ 12:54 pm
And I concur with wdbrand on a gardening blog. There are many gardening enthusiasts here, and some of the blogs like the Weather Journal and Fridge Magnet sometimes dip into gardening issues and discussion among commenters, but having a blog dedicated to or oriented for gardening questions and issues would be spectacular.
Comment by Other John — March 6, 2012 @ 1:00 pm
I do not like the anonymity as it leads to trolling. I believe that if you want it like a front poarch setting, then you need to know who is on your porch. Would prefer an after the fact review and removal of inappropriate posts.
Comment by Richard J Beason, CPA — March 6, 2012 @ 1:27 pm
Dana – I wish I could believe that the RT is sincere about running a clean blog, but apparently your own editorial staff doesn’t monitor Dan Casey’s blog or Dan’s own mean spirited and insulting comments towards some of the Conservative bloggers. He lets his Liberal minions “pile on” and bully some bloggers, while he turns a blind eye, and even encourages and participates in attacks on others. Until the RT cleans up their own back yard, it is doubtful you will see any improvement in the behavior of its participating bloggers.
Comment by Matt Herring — March 6, 2012 @ 1:30 pm
Thanks for the great comments!
Looks like we may need to explore opportunities like a gardening blog or other places that may be a natural spinoff. I’ll pass this along to our team for a future post.
In the meantime, would anyone like to expound on the facebook login concerns I see have been brought up? What if it were optional? How do you use sites like Pinterest that use facebook as a login?
Thanks – Dana, RefreshRT team member.
Comment by Dana Bailey — March 6, 2012 @ 1:44 pm
Connect to Facebook or require some other identity requirement and I’m out of here. Like Babs in #17, I have a variety of reasons why I can’t post using my true identity, both work and personal related.
As to the commenting, I would like to see some sort of limits on some of the free-for-all posting that goes on, when someone hijacks a thread. I enjoy Dan Casey’s columns and blogs, but when that horrible Suzie gets involved, decent discussions go off track with her off-the-wall and inappropriate comments and the follow-up posts from people who just can’t ignore her. There is censorship and then there is taking control for the good of the cause — it’s your sandbox and you should be able to determine who gets to play in it.
It would also be nice if there were a way to keep the RT topics from dropping out of sight so quickly. Some discussions get going rather well but fade too soon because they get “lost” to another page/screen as the days move on. Same goes for some of the other blogs and discussions.
And if you could come up with a more reliable captcha system so “copy” a post just in case doesn’t have to be the norm if the system barfs on the code entered.
Comment by Joe Hokie — March 6, 2012 @ 1:47 pm
FWIW:
I access the sports blogs, Happy Wag and Kevin Myatt’s weather blog. I am in full agreement with Other John (something which does not always happen on AM’s Sports Blog) regarding Facebook login, and on anonymity. The RT has my email if they need to id me, and for professional purposes, I do not wish to have my identity show up on Google searches, etc.
Also, I commend the speed which Aaron’s blog gets comments posted. In an interactive environment with other readers and moderators/blog owners, a several hours delay is a string killer.
Comment by ken — March 6, 2012 @ 1:53 pm
I will not frequent any site that requires log-in or Face Book or Twitter. PERIOD!!!!!!
Comment by wdbrand — March 6, 2012 @ 2:13 pm
Nake that after log-in.
Comment by wdbrand — March 6, 2012 @ 2:56 pm
Make that after the required registeration and log-in. I’ll get it right if you give me enough tries.
Comment by wdbrand — March 6, 2012 @ 3:00 pm
Thank you for again for all your comments. We are reading all of them and passing them along to our redesign team. We appreciate all your feedback. -Dana, RefreshRT team member
Comment by Dana Bailey — March 6, 2012 @ 4:59 pm
I pretty much like things the way they are. I read Kevin Myatt everyday but rarely comment on the blog. I read The Storefront and Fridge Magnet most every day, then catch up on them if I miss a day. I do comment on each of those blogs, and I’m like OJ and some of the others above, leave the hateful and negative stuff OFF of here! Some people make just plain mean comments and there is no call for that! Criticizing/making fun of people just because they have a different opinion isn’t helpful to anyone. It’s no fun to see that stuff whether they are writing about you or not! As far as Facebook or Tweeter, forget about it! I don’t have an account w/ either and never will, so that would be a negative for me personally. One thing I would like to see is an open forum, particularly on Lindsey’s blog, that would let folks re-visit earlier posts about specific restaurants…to add a review or whatever. Thanks for the opportunity to comment here!
Comment by Dennis — March 6, 2012 @ 5:20 pm
The only blog I follow (but rarely comment on) is Kevin Myatt’s weather blog. That blog is my “go to” site for weather information – better than anything else, by far. The way that blog functions is, in my opinion, excellent. Kevin Myatt does a great job – he keeps up with comments, interjects additional information when needed, and, most importantly, keeps the blog discussion on point and civil. I am not interested in following any blog or other comment opportunity that allows uncivil discourse to occur. I am also not interested in logging in via FB or Twitter, but understand that the RT may pursue these opportunities if a significant number of readers are interested in this route.
Comment by NRV Carol — March 6, 2012 @ 5:59 pm
I am a very frequent commenter on Kevin Myatt’s Weather Blog, and love his blog!! I agree with others, such as wdbrand, that if you require a log-in with a facebook or Twitter account, I will be gonzo AND EXTREMELY UNHAPPY!!! And I am sure that a large percentage of other commenters on that blog would feel the same as wd and a few others and me.
However, there is a wild “gorilla” running around the KM Weather Blog eating comments when it gets hungry :>) :>) :>) , and that is the infamous “CAPTCHA CODE!! (“CC)” If it reduces or prevents spam on the KMWB, great. But many of us have made lengthy comments and either (A) forgotten to enter the CC, or (B) entered it incorrectly, or (C) “taken too long” to complete our comment, and we get an error message. But when we hit the “Back” button to return to the blog and our comment that is pending a correct CC, IT IS GONE!!! It did not use to happen this way, but has been happening just as I portrayed for at least 5 months now, probably even longer. The CAPTCHA CODE needs to become much more “user friendly.” If a poll could be taken of Kevin Myatt Blog commenters of their biggest complaint about the blog, the CAPTCHA CODE would be a close 2nd behind complaints that the guy named Griggs makes too many comments!!
Comment by Doug Griggs of SW Roanoke County — March 6, 2012 @ 7:41 pm
A fellow named “ken” praised Aaron for how speedy he is in posting comments to the blog in question. Exactly the same can be said for Kevin Myatt, and I would be willing to bet a large sum (and I am a very reluctant bettor) that nearly everyone else who comments on the Weather Blog would agree with my assertion. Some/many of us don’t know how he does it! I have met KM personally a few times, and think he is a terrific guy.
Comment by Doug Griggs of SW Roanoke County — March 6, 2012 @ 7:45 pm
INPUT FOR YOUR NEW FORMAT…
Don’t want to sign in with facebook, yahoo or others. It creates a permanent record on those accounts and spams my friends, too. It’s insulting.
Live chats are great, but do them with the newsmakers, too! (A staff member can type for them if necessary.)
However, they have to be done right, which would mean doing them the way AOL did years ago… If you’re unfamiliar, it was elegantly simple… Every user could choose any color and font style for the text they typed in. The multiple contrasts made it much easier to follow the 20, 30, 40 speakers all happening at the same time.
And, you need a “mute” feature, where you can simply choose not to see anything from particular authors. This way, if a child (of any age) starts spewing crap or drivel, within minutes the kid is all alone. And you can also eliminate the other regular folks you simply aren’t interested in hearing from. It works terrific.
Note: This mute feature would be excellent for your various blogs, too For example, I really like Dan Casey’s. But I read it less than I might and virtually never post on it. Why? One participant has singlehandedly made it unpleasant. She posts crap against everyone she disagrees with, who then feel compelled to respond to the abuse, and the flames ping pong back and forth. Ugh. She has obvious problems, but there’s nothing we can do. Being able to choose to never look at her posts would be the solution for grown-ups like me who simply refuse to swim in a pool with this much pee in it.
PLEASE give us adults a way to filter out the idiots we do not wish to hear an opinion from. (It’s called a block option on Facebook, and I know most of us would be willing to spend a moment typing in an occasional name.)
Lastly, every comment should auto post without Dan (or other bloggers at your paper) having to approve it. It’s a nightmare supervision for them, having to check their blogs like a baby in a crib every hour. Simply reviewing every 24 hours is more than sufficient. You’ll have a “flag” option as well, I trust, which can go to whatever staff member is on call. If they are unsure, then they can redirect the flag to the blogger (Dan in my example) who checks it once a day.
Comment by Dave Gresham — March 6, 2012 @ 9:00 pm
I pretty much only comment on Kevin Myatt’s weather blog and he does a fantastic job of keeping it a place where it is civil, regular commenters are friends with each other and it is informative and stays largely on the weather topic and even if it doesn’t it is well received. We are all good there!
While on other sections of RT website, comments are less civil, I haven’t seen it rise to the harsh comments that I notice on Yahoo, AOL and other places. I am a baby boomer and am comfortable with using technology but also value my privacy. I do not like the idea of using facebook/twitter to sign in at all as lines of privacy are too blurred for me. Requiring me to register for an account and sign in will pretty much be a deal breaker for me. I can live with the GOTCHA code and understand its purpose, but PLEASE allow us to use the back button and reenter the code so we don’t have to retype our comments. I can’t always read the code too well. ARRRRGGGGHHHHH
Comment by Indian Valley John — March 6, 2012 @ 10:55 pm
I would like automatic posting with a “Report This” that people can click if they find a comment offensive. It would be up to the moderator to determine if it is offensive, and then remove it.
As someone else mentioned, as a reader of Dan Casey’s blog, I would love the ability to hide comments like you can on Facebook.
Comment by Debbie — March 7, 2012 @ 5:27 am
Like others, I was pointed to this post from a recent Kevin Myatt entry. I know Kevin personally so I’ll refrain from saying too many nice things about him (just kidding, Kevin!), but reading the post – and the conversation here – has given me pause to think about what I like about the RT compared to some other news sites I frequent.
Regarding Facebook: The comments about Facebook, and especially privacy concerns, are relatively well-established.. My experience has been that requiring a Facebook account rarely does much to address any civility concerns that might arise from anonymous or semi-anonymous commenting. One only needs to visit the brand pages for one of the dozens of sponsors involved in the recent Rush Limbaugh to see that civil discourse doesn’t necessarily correlate with identity, regardless of how any individual person feels about the situation.
That said, I enjoy what the RT has been doing with social media, both on Twitter and Facebook. It’s both unique and refreshing, especially when compared to some competing news outlets in the state. People are already commenting on these stories on Facebook and Twitter, and I would be interested to see those comments synchronized and displayed on your site with each story. Maybe integrated with whatever commenting system you decide to adopt? I realize there are some challenges with that, but it might be one way to find a happy medium.
Something I would like to see that someone else mentioned – and I apologize for being too lazy to scroll back and see who did so above – is threaded commenting. I’d enjoy a lightweight (not browser-intensive) way to expand and collapse threads as I read through the comments.
Ultimately, the interaction with the commenters from your writers and moderators is what makes this community special. I don’t frequent many blogs other than Kevin’s, but I do enjoy the active conversations that happen in those spaces. Whatever you do, don’t lose that.
Comment by Dan — March 7, 2012 @ 5:43 am
Please don’t fix what is not broken. Unless Kevin Myatt’s job would be easier with a new format, we have a wonderful and well used weather blog.I rarely post, but read the comments every day, including all of Doug Grigg’s (I find them extremely interesting). I too would not return if it is connected to Facebook or Twitter.
Comment by Elizabeth — March 7, 2012 @ 7:48 am
The comments system on the Weather Blog works well.
Kevin’s knowledgeable, witty, and cheerful comments are the best (and please do whatever you can to keep him with us), but the give-and-take and reports from the field are also fun. I myself do not comment, but I like to read the comments, and any policy that discourages them is probably not one you should choose.
Comment by AboutComments — March 7, 2012 @ 9:33 am
Wow, if all comments were as civil and reasoned as these, our direction would be really clear.
I’m a staff writer here and a member of the team examining the comments issue. As I said, these are rich, helpful comments.
I’d like to prod you to respond more to question #3 above:
What other ways would you like to engage with us? For example, would you participate in live chats with reporters/editors/photographers on particular stories? Any other ideas?
Comment by Matt Chittum, The Roanoke Times — March 7, 2012 @ 11:29 am
I’m often not available for live chats. I think the first and last one I did was on the 2008 elections. It was pretty cool, but most of the time when these happen, I’m simply not available.
I have, however, taken numerous emails and/or phone calls from various columnists through the years, after posting comments on certain blog threads…like with Lindsey Nair, Jennie Boone (when she ran the Storefront), Dan Casey, Aaron McFarling, Kevin Myatt, and others. Sometimes it’s been to clarify something I wrote so it could be used in a column, other times it’s been for an interview for a column or article, which was actually pretty enjoyable.
Actually, now that I remember right, I have participated in sort of live-action blogging with Aaron McFarling during VT football season, watching the game and commenting as the games went on. This was done through the regular blog comment section, and that works well enough when comments can be quickly approved. It allows good interaction between different commenters and the moderator that way.
If live chats could happen at different times of day say than midday during the week, that would be helpful, and I might be more inclined to participate in them, if the topics were interesting to me.
Comment by Other John — March 7, 2012 @ 12:37 pm
Well, I have to say I’m glad to see so many Weather Journal commenters/visitors here and rather touched by what you have to say.
From the comments moderating standpoint — it can be a challenge strictly in volume when we’re in an active weather period and so many pour in at once noting weather observations at their location. That of course is what I want to see! I finally moved into the 21st century last year and bought a smartphone that allows approval of comments remotely, which helps when I’m not right at a computer keyboard during these rapid-fire periods, mostly near winter storms and somewhat less so during severe weather outbreaks. I remember on the afternoon of Dec. 18, 2009, while I was stuck in traffic driving to the office through the first inch or 2 of 18 how many hundreds of comments poured in while I was on the road — fortunately, my wife Erica (the community news editor at the RT) and some of the online staff helped get comments approved.
But in general I like the ability to approve comments before they appear, because one hateful comment can sour the entire string. (Also, the spam blocking and CAPTCHA aren’t perfect, and there’s spam and porn garbage that sometimes gets through.) In 6 years of weather blogging, I’ve disallowed fewer than 20 comments, total. I think the idea that we’re going to have polite discussion has been communicated and well accepted. Basically I don’t allow name-calling and insulting, anything that questions someone’s character, and I derail political conversation quickly — lots of other venues for that. As for staying on subject, weather touches a wide area of our lives, so when the weather is relatively quiet I allow discussion to stray pretty widely. I keep it more tightly focused when we’re entering an intense weather period.
I know CAPTCHA is a pain for many (I will have to fill out a CAPTCHA to get this comment published — I don’t on Weather Journal) and I am interested about some of the ideas regarding replies appearing under the comments they refer to, likes/dislikes, etc.
Comment by Kevin Myatt — March 7, 2012 @ 3:40 pm
A site that does have a comment system I kind of like is hamptonroads.com…the site for the Virginian Pilot out of Norfolk.
Their comment section has the ability to do thumbs up/down on comments, reporting abuse, and hiding all comments from particular users. You must register for them, but the registration is fairly similar to what it’s like to register at roanoke.com…except you pick a screen/user name that appears when posting comments.
That’s the kind of system I’d like to see, if substantial changes are made to the present one.
Comment by Other John — March 7, 2012 @ 5:13 pm
I am a semi regular poster on Kevin’s Weather Blog and pretty much agree with his thoughts. I would like a “reply to” function for posters and if Facebook is linked I doubt I’ll be posting much.
Comment by Johnny — March 7, 2012 @ 7:16 pm
I like the Weather Journal blog just like it is. I don’t do Facebook or Twitter…..ever, and will be gone if you link that to the blog. Kevin is a great blog moderator and most of the frequent commentators are too……just a great blog, so don’t change it.
Comment by Rick in Wytheville — March 7, 2012 @ 8:40 pm
I “own” one or possibly two of the comments that he has had to reject, but it wasn’t because of bad language or big temper or name-calling. I think it was during a relatively calm period (like nearly the entire summer can be, unless there is a big rainstorm or thunderstorm “invading”). I cannot even remember the details, but I remember when I submitted it saying to myself, “Gee, I wonder if Kevin (or “KM” as I sometimes call him … he puts up with it awfully well …) will have to reject it because of RT corporate policy?” Sure enough, he did, and explained it IMMEDIATELY in an e-mail to me. I was fine with it, and either re-phrased my comment, or deep-sixed it. It is possible that he included every sentence except the one that violated policy.
Comment by Doug Griggs of SW Roanoke County — March 7, 2012 @ 9:30 pm
FYI, if you use Google Chrome as your browser, the Captcha Code gremlin is a thing of the past. The back button brings your post right back up and you can then enter the correct code. You can also go back umpteen posts if you have not closed out.
The only real downside is that on some blogs (Dan Casey/Blue Ridge Caucus) the post numbers show up inside the avatars making it harder to keep up with the post numbers.
I switched and I love it.
BTW, Kevin Myatt, line of the day: “one hateful comment can sour the entire string“. Politics and cultural conversations are going to get heated but allowing real hate, as some here have already pointed out, ruins a perfectly good thread.
I think some are confusing their anonymity with the RT knowing who you are through some sort of sign in and I am sorry but if you want to come into their “house” or chew the fat on their “porch”, the least you can do is tell them who you are while you remain anonymous to the rest of the world.
I would LOVE to talk to reporters/writers, ask questions and suggest stories as well as discuss news articles and local happenings. This is a great site, but it could be improved and I would be happy to pay for the privilege too. I will support any change you need to make.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — March 7, 2012 @ 10:00 pm
I, also, like the idea of being able to “like” a comment made by another poster, as well as being able to see from whom those likes came from, similar to Facebook or other news websites that do the “thumbs up/thumbs down”. Also, faster approval of comments would make for better real time discussions. Chat rooms would also be interesting, if they were moderated, of course.
Comment by belle — March 8, 2012 @ 8:08 am
This is ole Richard Sampson from up here down in Willis, Va. How yall doin this fine thursday mornin? I’m doin alright, bout 50 degreese and sunny as all get out up here, kinda like it.
Far as that commentin talk goes, ill put it to yall like this. I aint never been one to get tied up in all that facebook nonsense or twitter for that matter. Shoot, Prudence, my wife of 17 years, is the reason im on here. Ive always been one to enjoy the weather and she found out about this feller named Kevin who knows his stuff and showed it to me. She’d pull it up and let me read it then finally got to the point where I figured out how to comment and its one of the things i look forward to. aint too complicated and easy enough for me to enjoy. dont get that much these days.
all im sayin is that, if it aint broke dont “fix” it. n if it went to twitter or facebook, id likely be unable to enjoy this anymore. maybe make it more immediate, think yall call it live streamin or something with the comments, but i think ole buddy kevin does a fine job. smart as all get out too, only blogged i read and keep up with. Kinda like workin on the ole 78 ford, just daily business and pure enjoyment.
thank yall and yall have a gooden,
Richard S.
ps…mean i can take the blade off the 78 with it being warm these days?
Comment by Richard Sampson in Willis, Va — March 8, 2012 @ 9:21 am
I do like the idea of being able to “like” or respond to comments on the blogs. It would make it much easier to follow as we often times say “refer to post #68 on the previous blog” etc. Post #’s don’t show up on either of my computers currently, so I often times have to do investigative work to see what is being replied to. I also like the idea of having a “report abuse” button. If something shows up that shouldn’t be there or is questionable, we should be able to report that to the blog moderator.
As far as sign-in goes, we currently have to sign in with our email address anyway in order to post. Moderators are able to contact us if something is amiss. Spamming our friends/followers on Facebook and Twitter is not something that I would see as beneficial if we had to use those to log in.
Comment by Shanon "Nurse Snow" — March 8, 2012 @ 10:09 am
I enjoy following Weather Journal, Storefront, Fridge Magnet and AMac blogs and accompanying comments …occasionally post, but Facebook would only serve to deter me from commenting …Captcha Code ‘ok’ …IMO Facebook has absolutely nothing to offer
Comment by Walter — March 8, 2012 @ 3:25 pm
I would like to offer my thoughts from my experience as a user, moderator, and administrator of an internet forum.
I think requiring logging in to the Roanoke Times’ site is one defensive strategy to take against spammers. I have seen forums employing CAPTCHA code to require users to authenticate themselves before the system accepted their registration, and an email would be sent to the user requring them to confirm their email address as valid.
Other John hit it earlier. I think a better cookie tracking system is needed. When I was playing “Fearless Forecaster” during football season, I had to log in to cast my ballot, but when I went to the Roanoke Times’ home page, the log-in information disappeared and was replaced with the standard “Log In” kind of information on the top of the page. I think the ability to add “keep me logged in until I’m logged out” or “Remember Me” would take care of the need to log in on every visit. Naturally, there’s concern for privacy, especially if the visitors are on a public computer (library, coffee shop, etc).
I don’t have a problem with the idea of using Facebook, Google+, AIM, Yahoo, or Twitter account as options to log in as long as user are given the option to register on the site.
Entering CAPTCHA code on blog post is very annoying, cumbersome, and sometime my comment don’t always show up until the next day (or on Monday if it’s during the weekend). Once again, I think the need for CAPTCHA could be eliminated by requiring a log in. Guests could view comments, but will need to sign up or log in to post comment.
The blogs I visit, based on my heavy frequent visiting, is Aaron McFarling’s, Andy Bitter’s, and on occasion, Kevin Myatt’s (especially since he’s so darned accurate with his forecast).
Another thing I’d like to express is I’d like to see a much improve mobile site than what I currently see when using an Android tablet or my Blackberry. For example, I don’t have problem viewing Aaron’s or Kevin’s blogs through a mobile theme, but when I visit Andy Bitter’s blog, it’s always in a full page view. I would encourage Roanoke Times to strongly consider having a text-based with limited graphic mobile sites set up for faster browsing experience.
Comment by Trevor — March 8, 2012 @ 7:40 pm
To answer question #3, one thing I truly enjoy Aaron’s blogs is how he would challenge the knowledge of readers with “Song of the Day” section, and recently, he adopted the “Six Word” challenge that we had to create a story, just using six words. Those are the kind of stuff that keeps us coming back to Aaron’s blog.
I do wish the RT would do away with CAPTCHA during Aaron’s live blogging of Virginia Tech or Virginia’s game so I don’t have to resort to using Twitter to comment on the game with my amateurish analysis.
Andy Bitter just provides the kind of in-depth analysis that could be found on sites such as Rivals.com, and his insight is extremely informative. I can’t help but appreciate his diligence and commitment. One thing I want to applaud his journalism is he stays objective, he don’t take sides, and that doesn’t sit well with some Virginia Tech’s fans (a very small percentage, that is).
As for Kevin Myatt, what else can I say I haven’t already said? Accurate, intelligent, and it’s clear the man know his stuff about weather. I don’t pay attention to any news station. I pay attention to Myatt.
Oh, one more thing! I would love for there to be a ability to add formatting to text, in bold, italics, or the ability to add hyperlink without having to resort to typing out the HTML code. I think it’s called rich text editor kind of thing. And a smiley system too.
Comment by Trevor — March 8, 2012 @ 7:50 pm
Since someone brought up AOL above. I will tell you what we used to do when I was a moderator at AOL in the mid to late 90s.
AOL had a very strict Terms of Service that did not allow any 4 letter words, harassment, hate speech, etc… but the anonymity the burgeoning Internet afforded still let people go over the top.
A User got 3 strikes against the Terms of Service. They would get a warning explaining what they did wrong, and made them review the terms again. Once they acknowledged their first warning, A second strike in the future would kick them offline and repeat the process, with a warning that a third time would result in a ban from the service. Third time was a termination.
This didn’t stop people from making multiple accounts, under fake names, especially after AOL went to a free format. Now it’s much easier to track a person by their IP address, and multiple violations could result in a more permanent ban.
The point is, you have to hold people accountable for their actions if you want a constructive community. Otherwise you will just get a whole ton of people screaming and making it a horrible experience. Even more horrible than the idea of letting anyone post in any color or font. That actually caused some people to have epileptic seizures due to some crazy color combinations. No Lie. I saw the complaint from the attorney.
The easiest way to hold people accountable is to force them to register and log-in. Facebook makes it quite easy to do so, but I understand why people would be hesitant to join facebook… however it’s very easy to set up a login system that can use facebook OR a unique login identifier. It just attaches to your email address, with a separate “display ID”, to preserve privacy. (similar to what exists now on Roanoke.com) People may scream about not using the system if they have to log in, but a one-time registration is no big deal, and ultimately they will when a topic gets to them.
I definitely love the idea of a like/dislike button which either promotes or hides certain posts. I also like a certain level of nesting so you can follow a conversation, but sometimes it is very difficult to see where one conversation ends and another begins, so it has to be limited to maybe 2 or 3 tiers.
Comment by scott — March 8, 2012 @ 8:29 pm
I guess people either love or hate Facebook, it sure has a lot of people for so many disses.
Dave Gresham, I am not sure what is meant by “Don’t want to sign in with facebook, yahoo or others. It creates a permanent record on those accounts and spams my friends, too. It’s insulting.” Could you or someone else explain? The few times I have signed in to a new site using my FB they ASKED me to access my account and contacts and I just say no. No one has ever said they got spam from me and I am all over the www. I am confused on what you mean.
I am assuming a FB feed would be like the Twitter feed is on the sidelines now, you can read and participate or ignore it. And I did not understand them to say they would REQUIRE anyone to sign in with either. Have I missed something?
Love the idea of a “like/dislike” vote on posts, some people are so eloquent, well reasoned or researched that they deserve applause and of course the (scourge of the www) trolls should be voted off, but you only get one vote per post.
If the reporters would like and participate, I love the idea of stories having threads and “more” of the story.
I do not think this will add to information necessarily, but I do hope you will consider giving right wingers and ultra conservative, religious etc folks a blog to call home. I think having their own sandbox might help the other blogs be more welcoming. I know many people who refuse to comment because of the back lash they regularly deliver. It is also just a fair thing to do. Everyone wants to find their “Cheers”.
Most of all, I think the Roanoke Times and Roanoke.com should give each moderator the authority to engage, chat, joke, be real and open as well as free to block users, delete posts and ban repeat violators at will. No one should be compelled to take and respond to abuse and insults.
BTW, thanks for asking!
Comment by Sandi Saunders — March 8, 2012 @ 8:48 pm
Make it work well for people on smartphones. The current system is nice.
Comment by Cliff — March 12, 2012 @ 5:02 pm