2012.02.13
Editorial: Extracurricular activities
Bending the rules for home-schoolers
For every Tim Tebow, there are dozens of Cam Newtons making their way through public schools. Let’s not sideline them.
Tim Tebow may someday be canonized as the patron saint of home-schoolers. He is the inspiration behind Virginia lawmakers’ success in advancing a bill toward passage that would allow home-schoolers the opportunity Tebow enjoyed in Florida: to play sports at a public high school so as to come to the notice of college scouts.
The House of Delegates last week sent to the Senate a bill (H.B. 947) that, in the words of its official summary, “prohibits public schools from joining an organization governing interscholastic programs that does not deem eligible for participation” home-schoolers who meet certain eligibility requirements, though not those required of public school students.
This is hilarious.
Comment by Uptheriver — February 13, 2012 @ 8:42 am
Will the home-schoolers be entitled to school bus transportation? In many rural areas, areas this bill supposedly targets, the schools provide transportation home after practices.
Comment by Rick — February 13, 2012 @ 8:49 am
2 – well, their parents pay taxes to support it…so why not?
Comment by The Other Rick — February 13, 2012 @ 11:06 am
Spot on and well said!
Comment by Sandi Saunders — February 13, 2012 @ 11:08 am
What tax is that The Other Rick? People keep saying that but no one yet has explained even one tax that parents with school age children pay that the rest of us do not. And no one has yet to own the fact that parents with children at home schools or public schools get a tax deduction that the rest of us do not. So what tax do they pay exactly?
Comment by Sandi Saunders — February 13, 2012 @ 12:09 pm
So even the namesake of the law “gamed” the system by renting an apartment outside of where the family lived to participate for a particular high school. This could potentially take high school atheletic recruiting to a new level in VA . From Wikipedi…”In 1996, legislation was passed in Florida allowing homeschooled students to compete in local high school sporting events. The law specifies that homeschooled students may participate on the team of the local school in the school district in which they live. The Tebows lived in Jacksonville, Florida, and he played linebacker and tight end at the local Trinity Christian Academy for one season. Tebow’s preferred position was quarterback, but Trinity football team’s offense did not rely on passing the football, so he moved into an apartment in nearby St. Johns County, making him eligible to play for the pass-oriented offense at Nease.”
Comment by Rick — February 13, 2012 @ 1:27 pm
Excellent point Rick #6, can of worms.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — February 13, 2012 @ 1:57 pm
What is everyone so scared of?
” For every Tim Tebow, there are dozens of Cam Newtons making their way through public schools. Let’s not sideline them.”
Funniest thing I’ve still read today.
Comment by Uptheriver — February 13, 2012 @ 2:32 pm
Wow… talk about some totally unrelated comparisons. The attempts at making examples with the Eldery Woman, the Out-Of-Shape fellow, and the Less-Athletic Home-schoolers, etc are WAY out there.
There’s absolutely no reason not to let the home-schooled kids try out for the public school sports teams in their community. As long as they have to try out just like everyone else, I don’t see a reason to keep them from it.
The example scenario posted in response 6 with Tebow gaining residency in an apartment to play for a certain school already happens all the time in high school sports right here in our area. So using that as a potential can of worms is irrelevant.
Comment by hokie24 — February 13, 2012 @ 3:20 pm
5 – The same state and local taxes that everyone pays. Even if they home-school their kids, parents still pay state income tax, local real estate and personal property taxes, sales taxes, etc.
Yes, they get a small deduction on the state income taxes…but NO deductions on local real estate or personal property taxes because of their children. No deductions on state and local sales taxes either. In fact, families with children likely pay more overall sales tax because of the expenses of feeding, clothing and the numerous other costs of raising children.
Comment by The Other Rick — February 13, 2012 @ 3:22 pm
The next thing to come out of the GA will be discrimination legislation after Jessup, the homeschooler, gets the snot kicked out of him at practice. The APEs are soft anyway, that’s why they didn’t send their precious ones to get educated with the heathens.
Comment by Rick — February 13, 2012 @ 3:34 pm
@11 – So let them compete. What is everyone so scared of?
Comment by Uptheriver — February 13, 2012 @ 4:30 pm
So the home-schoolers don’t like the way the teachers in public schools teach or they don’t like their little darlings associating with the heathens, but they need to be able to play sports so they can get noticed by the Hokies so they can go on to an NFL career. To do this, they get special treatment and only have to abide by some of the VHSL rules while the kids who go to public school all day have to follow all the rules. To make it sound “right” this is wrapped up in some “fairness” deal because their parents pay taxes like everyone else so that makes it OK. Yeah, I pay taxes but I don’t get to pick and choose what I want to do and not do. I don’t swim at the Frog Pond nor do I ever expect to, so I should get a break on my taxes and not have to pay as much since there isn’t an equivalent deal that can be worked out like this “let my special kid play sports deal.” Maybe there can be a whole laundry list of things set up that people can check off what they want to pay for, like the voluntary contributions that are on the state income tax form.
Sorry, but this attack on public education is just another attempt to breach the system by the voucher crowd. Pretty convenient if your kid is a good athlete and goes to a school of your choosing on the taxpayers’ dime, but can show up after school to play on Salem’s high-power football team with no strings attached so he can catch Frank Beamer’s eye.
If you can’t follow all the rules, then you don’t get to play the game.
Comment by Joe Hokie — February 13, 2012 @ 4:42 pm
Oh come off it with the excuse that homeschoolers wouldn’t be following all of the same rules. If anything, the homeschoolers are likely following a more difficult program of study than many kids in public schools and would be looked at under more scrutiny.
It’s about kids wanting to play on sports teams because they don’t have another place to play, or enough kids in the same situation to form their own teams. Why try to add all of this other political crap to it?
The sad part is that if this bill didn’t have Tim Tebow and his openly religious behavior attached to it, a lot more folks would be in support of it. Most of the folks opposed to this wouldn’t be opposed if they didn’t think that they were fighting against religion in some way. This isn’t about religion. It’s not about becoming a pro athlete. It’s about getting kids the best opportunity to play in their area. How many kids make it to the pros in their sport? I don’t think the main driver for this is for little Timmy to make sure a pro scout sees him play ball. All of this effort wouldn’t be happening for those 1 in a million shots.
The opening line was great though… “For every Tim Tebow, there are dozens of Cam Newtons making their way through public schools. Let’s not sideline them.”
Yeah… because Cam Newton made it through school the right way…. right?
Comment by hokie24 — February 14, 2012 @ 11:40 am
Precisely The Other Rick! “The same state and local taxes that everyone pays”. Parents do not pay more or special taxes because they have children. WE ALL pay the same taxes and for the same reasons. So stop using that like it is buying them something they are not getting. Our nation benefits from a literate educated populace, any society does. THAT is why we ALL pay for education, even those who never have children and those who home school.
I will not “come off it”, I think that the choice to leave the school system was the choice of the parent and there are few communities in Virginia without Rec Leagues of one kind or another, they have just decided they WANT a cafeteria style choice in their child’s life that IMO they forfeited. Too bad. YOU made the choice that you feel is hurting your child, not us.
Since the whole point is to “try out” they have no right to take the place of whatever actual student who would be cut. NONE. This is a can of worms that needs to stay closed and you people need to live with your decisions like public school parents live with the negatives in theirs.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — February 14, 2012 @ 12:46 pm
#14, no, they won’t be following all the rules, only some of the rules. This is from the Feb. 3 story in the RT:
VHSL chief Ken Tilley said he is against the proposed legislation because it would grant home-schooled students eligibility at public schools without requiring them to meet the same standards required of public school students, such as passing five courses per semester and maintaining minimum grade-point averages.
“You can’t have someone playing by one set of rules, which only requires them to meet six of the 13 eligibility requirements that the league requires,” Tilley said. “There are 400,000 public school students that have to meet 13 out of those requirements. Does that sound fair to you?”
Six out of 13 rules sounds like “not all the same rules” to me. If the head honcho of the organization that sets the rules that all the public schools have to follow for sports and academic competitions (debate and some other activities come in there, too) doesn’t believe that this is a good thing, then that says something about how bad this bill is.
Again, why is it that the home school people should be allowed to pick and choose what they get to do with their tax money? What makes them special, other than the fact that they are part of the conservative movement that has taken over our fair Commonwealth and is helping the push to destroy public education? Why can’t I have a checkbox on my tax return that says I don’t want my money going to the Attorney General’s office to support his goofy time-wasting, tax-dollar wasting stunts designed to raise his stature and status? I sure don’t support Kooky and his actions, but I don’t seem to have a choice. Neither should the homeschoolers in putting their kids on the public school playing fields.
Again, if you don’t play by all the rules, you don’t get to play the game.
Comment by Joe Hokie — February 14, 2012 @ 4:28 pm
If the examples of some of the rules that home schoolers wouldn’t be following are, “passing five courses per semester and maintaining minimum grade-point averages,” then that’s also a pretty weak argument. Most home schoolers tend to do pretty well as far as their grades and GPAs, so it’s not like they wouldn’t be capable of upholding those rules. If anything, those homeschoolers are doing more school work than public schoolers. There’s no reason to act like these homeschool kids are little dummys who couldn’t keep up academically with the public school kids, because I think we all know that this is far from the truth.
Bringing up all of the tax arguments is just skirting the issue. It sounds like the same nonsense that people bring up when they argue against gay marriage. For example, I’ve actually heard things as stupid as, “If we allow gay marriage… the next step is to allow people to marry things other than people.” They always try to relate their argument to some other extreme situation that they believe is somehow related to the actual issue. Bringing up a desire to have choices and check boxes for your tax dollars instead of talking about figuring out how to get kids the best opportunity to try out for local, public sports, is just as stupid. The whole tax side of this is a non-issue. It’s about kids playing sports with the local kids, why try to turn it into something else? If the homeschool kid takes the roster spot of a public school kid fair and square, then the public school kid just needs to practice harder and take his spot back next season. I thought competition was a good thing??
And is this seriously part of your argument as well?? “If the head honcho of the organization that sets the rules that all the public schools have to follow for sports and academic competitions (debate and some other activities come in there, too) doesn’t believe that this is a good thing, then that says something about how bad this bill is.”
Have you ever seen a leader of an organization who is just itching to admit that the policies that he is supposed to be in charge of and enforce need to be changed? Of course he’s gonna say that he doesn’t think the bill is a good thing, it’s his job to support the current system.
Comment by hokie24 — February 15, 2012 @ 1:45 pm
IMO, “the best opportunity to try out for local, public sports” for students who are not in the school system is the recreational leagues, AAU and other avenues. The parents opted out of the public school system, no one took away any opportunity from their children except them.
It is not remotely “fair and square” for the home schooled kid to take the roster spot of a public school kid who is enrolled in that school. Competition among students enrolled is the only one that should matter for any team.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — February 15, 2012 @ 2:58 pm
No one said home schooled kids were not bright, but what is the who and how of measuring their grades and attendance?
The bigger concern is that something that is handled by the public schools, through a private organization (per its web site, the VHSL is a “private, non-profit organization whose members are the public high schools in the Commonwealth of Virginia”), is being overridden by a law coming out of Richmond and that is JUST HOW IT IS GOING TO BE! School superintendents, local administrators, the VHSL officials, and coaches will have no say, when the homeschooled kid shows up, the law will say “try him/her out and put the kid on the team.” Kind of goes against the whole “less government” that the conservatives throw around when they are screaming about taxes and how bad the Democratic Party is. But since the issue is to add more damage to public schools and lay more groundwork for vouchers, all the better to pass more laws to make some people more special, more equal than others.
Again, if you can’t follow all the rules, you don’t get to play the game.
Comment by Joe Hokie — February 15, 2012 @ 6:04 pm