The election’s end is in sight
After suffering through a painful, partisan election season, Virginians finally can cast their ballots.
Virginians who turned on a television or opened a mailbox during the last few months suffered. They endured twisted campaign ads and obnoxious mailings. They mourned as the truth whimpered and shriveled under neglect and abuse.
Take heart, fellow Virginians, today you receive your reward. Today, you have the precious privilege to vote.
November 6, 2012 - 7:19 AM
Interesting poll result here. Avast, a free online anti-virus software company, conducted this poll of 100,000 of their users. The results were interesting, particularly of Ohio.
I like this poll.
The election end is in sight but the crap that almost certainly will follow is not.
#3 – You’re right, gdad. I have no doubt whatsoever that Axelrod has lawyers on standby this very moment ready to file pre-written claims of voting fraud.
Deja vu in Philly…the NBP at it again:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7rkSmdDIIU&feature=player_embedded#!
3. Ha gdad, I agree with you.
5. ….the UN monitors will take care of it…LOL>
So do you know what voter intimidation is or are you just fussing? For people who think they are going to win, you seem awfully jumpy and irritable.
The NBP or KKK or your redneck cousin Clem can stand the requisite amount of space from the polls and stand there all day long too unless they are trespassing. The “watchers” who are challenging voters ability to vote and the registrars not doing their jobs are what voter suppression and intimidation is all about.
#8 – Here ya go, Sandi:
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/election-judge-wears-obama-cap-while-checking-voters-obamas-chicago-ward_661843.html
http://washingtonexaminer.com/philly-gop-poll-inspectors-being-ousted-for-dems/article/2512714#.UJkm9sXA-4d
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/06/judge-issuing-order-to-reinstate-booted-philadelphia-election-officials/
Here’s what voter intimidation looks like.
I know that if a KKK member were standing outside a polling place like that, most on the right would be equally outraged. I know I would be. This kind of garbage has no place in the voting process.
Libs don’t seem to have a problem with it though…as long as it’s the correct people doing it.
@11 Why the dig that “libs don’t see to have a problem”? Cannot people on all sides of the political spectrum agree that voter intimidation, no matter who’s doing it, is wrong?
#12 – Eric Holder sure didn’t seem to have an issue with a club-wielding Black Panther four years ago, Luanne, and it doesn’t get more blatant than that.
Because up to now, I haven’t seen any outrage or condemnation from the left about what the NBP is doing. All I see and hear are justification and excuses. Nothing was said or done about it in 2008…and now it’s happening again.
So yes, they definitely don’t seem to have a problem with it.
Again, how is ANYONE standing ANYWHERE, “voter intimidation”? NO ONE can go into the voting booth with you. Your vote is private and secret. What, other than stand out and bring attention to themselves can anyone standing near a polling place do to “intimidate” anyone? I think it is dumb and I thought election laws prevented it (but those are up to the 50 states). I know in Virginia, you cannot be within 100 feet or so of the doorway to the polls. ??-Been a while but I know there is a minimum.
“Seventy dispatched volunteers to the Philadelphia polling place at 11th St. and Germantown Avenue this morning, where reports surfaced earlier today that the New Black Panthers were back in Philly and at this polling place. Neither Seventy’s volunteers, nor City officials who visited the polling precinct and checked in with Seventy, saw any signs of the New Black Panthers. We’ll keep you posted, but as of now, no hard evidence that this report is true.”
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/cityhall/Election-Day—-Committee-of-Seventy-reports-problems-at-the-polls.html
Tuesday I voted for American Prosperity and American Jobs. A balanced Budget, and to reduce the burden on my children and grandchildren by reducing the national debt. Socialism has always failed where it’s tried so I voted for American values. We need American Leadership with a strong national defense. I’m casting my vote for Romney! I hope you do the same. We know what the past four years have been like. We really need hope and change now. Hope and change with American Values. Vote for America, not for Revenge!
@13 – That’s pure, partisan mythology. The so-called “incident” was investigated by the DOJ and the Civil Rights Commission. Both found no evidence of actual voter intimidation. And because Fox News and the right-wing echo chamber tried so hard to manufacture it into a controversy the DOJ investigators’ actions were reviewed by the DOJ’s Ethics Office and the DOJ Office of Profession Responsibility. Both found no evidence that anyone in the DOJ acted inappropriately or that they were being pressured by political or racial motivation. The facts supported their decisions and were in line with the law.
#15 – “Again, how is ANYONE standing ANYWHERE, “voter intimidation”?”
Many white people, faced with a black man wearing paramilitary garb, spouting racial garbage at the entrance to a polling place (as the Black Panthers did in 2008) would feel intimidated.
That’s how.
Can you really not see that?
I voted for Barack Obama and American prosperity, jobs and paying down our debt sensibly and equitably. I voted for my children and grandchildren (to be?) to have a better planet and a brighter future.
I voted for Obamacare.
I voted for women’s reproductive health and choice.
I voted for my gay friends.
I voted for the safety nets.
I did not see any Socialist on the ballot, but a truly backward candidate easily avoided thanks to Virginia listing the party.
I always vote for American values and American leadership is exemplified in President Obama! Now that we have the nation moving on from the economic collapse that serving the wealthy gave us, our hope and change will carry us forward to a brighter tomorrow for us all.
How many “white people” vote where this “black man wearing paramilitary garb, spouting racial garbage at the entrance to a polling place” supposedly happened?
#21 Thank you.
#21 – I don’t know how many white people were present, Sandi. But enough people felt intimidated enough to call the police about it.
And there is no “supposedly” about it…it did happen.
Right Luanne, because we know Democrats wouldn’t try to unduly influence voters, right?
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/politics/20121106_GOP_goes_to_court_to_remove_Obama_mural_at_polling_site.html
Sandi, maybe they had their eyes closed, because the video footage is hard to miss.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/nov/6/problems-black-panthers-surface-pa-polling-places/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS
Chuck, I didn’t say that Democrats wouldn’t try to influence voters or that Republicans wouldn’t either. There are extremists in each party. There are people who do things they shouldn’t in each party. I was saying that we should try not to generalize and tar everyone because of what a few renegades do.
Voter intimidation and voter fraud are wrong. Period.
And speaking of generalizations, not all liberals are Democrats, not all conservatives are Republican, and not everyone belongs to a political party.
20 – thank you, Sandi, for your relative honesty.
Oh yes, I see what you mean, opening the door for a couple of ladies is indeed intimidation! Oh the outrage!
http://wonkette.com/488748/fox-friends-new-black-panthers-back-and-intimidating-voters-by-holding-door-open-for-old-white-ladies
After this election and the shenanigans that have gone on, I am not sure how anyone defines “unduly” anymore either.
#27 – Why is it you refuse to acknowledge what happened in 2008, Sandi?
Ya know, every day I understand more and more of why you support Obama.
@17…JimW
I find it interesting that you don’t want to burden your children. We have a republican candidate that is beating the same drum; however, when Maxwell AFB showed up on a list of base reductions, she immediately started screaming that she would not let that base closure happen even though some of the services provided at Maxwell are being done at other bases more efficiently and with less expense. NIMBY perhaps?
Many on the right have screamed for the need to reduce the size of government, whether it be anti al, state or local. About the only way to reduce size is to reduce head count which means putting government workers on the unemployment line. That’s going to drive up the unemployment numbers and at the same time increase the what’s being paid out for unemployment benefits. At the same time, the Republicans want to reduce expenses relative to retraining a workforce so these people that are now out of work have fewer opportunities to re-enter the work force.
I realize that is indeed change…but is that change we can live with if its your son or daughter, husband or wife, or mother or father that is among the group to go?
It’s very easy to speak in broad based general rhetorical terms like politicians do; however, when you put a face to the consequence I becomes an entirely different picture.
That was supposed to read national, state or local…
Will, that is an excellent point, and you are right when you say the only way to reduce size is to reduce head count. The other half of the equation – which liberals and neoCons both ignore – is that if you cut the size of a federal agency (whether DOD or some other) by, say, half a million people (I don’t know…pick a number), there should be a commensurate return to the taxpayer of the amount no longer needed to keep those people employed by Uncle Sam. The return would most efficiently be in the form of a tax cut, which individuals and/or businesses (depending on how it’s structured) would then use to grow the economy, by buying more things, starting new businesses, expanding businesses, etc. This would be based on market forces of course, and would expand employment opportunities for the newly ex-government workers.
The hoorah over the NBP in 2012 is nothing more than a right-wing fabrication. One guy who was an authorized watcher MIGHT haver been at one spot. Big threat there.
@29…Michael
After seeing more and more of what you post, I can certainly understand why voting Republican is the wrong thing to do when you can’t acknowledge the mistakes of your own before screaming about the mistakes of others.
If you want to talk about dismal elections, you might want to move the clock back to 2000. The reason you lost in 08 was because your candidate chose an idiot for his vice presidential running mate.
Check the FOX NEWS website where there is a photo of Mr. Jackson dressed in black panther garb.
“Jerry Jackson, who was charged in the 2008 case along with Minister King Samir Shabazz, but later saw charges dropped by the Department of Justice, was seen early Tuesday outside a North Philadelphia voting site wearing the group’s trademark black beret, combat-style uniform and heavy boots. Fox News confirmed he is a designated poll watcher.”
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/11/06/new-black-panthers-back-at-philly-voting-site/#ixzz2BTfC49Yb
I appreciate the understanding Michael. I must admit I remain baffled at your support for Romney.
The reason I “refuse to acknowledge what happened in 2008″, or today is mainly as my good friends at Crooks and Liars put it:
I refuse to “make a federal case out of the inconsequentially semi-thuggish behavior of two black men acting as poll watchers in a district with 34 whites in a precinct of 970. Nearly two years later, Main Justice noted:
“No voters at all in the Philadelphia precinct have come forward to allege intimidation. The complaints have come from white Republican poll watchers, who have given no evidence they were registered to vote in the majority black precinct.”
http://crooksandliars.com/news-hound-ellen/fox-revives-its-bogus-new-black-p
I cannot get past the idea that I get beat up for “blaming” anything or anyone not President Obama, and for daring to dwell on the past and yet when you do it, I am still wrong for refusing to “acknowledge” whatever is bothering you. I suppose it is a lucky thing that I am not interested in pleasing you.
How will we EVER pay down the debt or eliminate deficits if we just give any dollar not spent back to those poor over burdened taxpayers? The hole we are in cannot allow for tax reductions in our near future, not if we are to be responsible.
@32…89Hoo
Before making any kind of returns to the tax payer, don’t you think it would be prudent to pay down the national debt that people seem to be so concerned about? I think it would make more sense to pay off the debt while rates are still low so as not to eat up so much of the principal pay down with interest.
Then you would have money freed up for investment such that business wouldn’t have to be competing with the government for money.
Look at that Will, great minds…
Sandi, Will – so what else happens when those companies expand, business start, people buy stuff, people hire people? Why, tax revenue increases! Which we can use to fill in the hole (pay down the debt).
When we are $16T in the hole (and counting) the best thing we can do is quit digging our hole deeper, and the way to do that is shrink the government, which means, as Will noted, cutting people. That stops (or at least slows) the digging. Then the question becomes(if you’ll allow continue this tortured analogy) how to fill in the hole. Government cannot do a thing without first extracting money from taxpayers, which means government cannot do a thing without digging a deeper hole.
We also need to stop our inflationary monetary policies and establish sound currency.
40 – since we need less revenue to go to the government, we can dedicate more to the debt.
To #37 (Sandi) and #38 (Will): Heh. You guys are starting to sound like deficit hawks. However, I think that you and 89Hoo are looking at two sides of the same point.
If the government were successfully paying all its bill, then cutting spending (by reducing headcount) would allow for taxes to be cut, thereby filling the pockets of individuals and businesses and helping the economy grow. If the government is borrowing lots of money, then cutting spending (by reducing headcount) would reduce the rate of borrowing, thereby pushing investors towards investing in businesses rather than Treasury securities and helping the economy grow.
In either case, the answer is the same: Strip government down to the bare essentials, so that tax burdens and/or redirected investment dollars can be kept to a minimum.
[Indeed, this is part of why the economy grow so strongly in the later Clinton years, a period when the government borrowed very little outside money. Investors had to put their money elsewhere. Today, business investment dollars are hard to find. The feds are vacuuming it all up.]
@40…89Hoo
The people who got laid off by the government are not going to be able to go out and immediately finds jobs in the private sector. Common sense tells you that.
Again, back to my point about the debt…it would be far better to pay off the debt sooner rather than later. You talk about wanting a strong base currency…what better way to do that than by being debt free?
@42…Brian
Just so you’ll know, I’ve always adhered to the “pay as you go” model both personally and in business. I don’t like debt unless there is a realistic plan by which to pay it back.
I say don’t change e revenue structure until the debt is paid down/off. Once you have the debt under control, then you modify the revenue stream to reflect the expense of running the government and not a moment sooner. Paying down the debt in and of itself will reduce the drain on available capital by the government.
Growth in the private sector, when it occurs too fast can be just as problematic as a no growth situation. Slow steady and meaningful growth will serve us all well. No more flukes like the housing crash.
Will I guess it depends on what is meant by “immediately”….there would be some lag, yes, but probably not a severe as you may think…an unfettered marketplace moves pretty quickly.
That said, I would have no problem setting debt reduction a higher priority than tax cuts, but in both cases, we must start with reducing spending…cutting the size of the government.
And sound money has little to do with debt and deficits per se, and everything to do with a currency based on something of value instead of government fiat.
No Brian, I do not agree that “the answer is the same: Strip government down to the bare essentials, so that tax burdens and/or redirected investment dollars can be kept to a minimum“. Government is not a business, it is not in it to make money, it is in it to run the nation and care for the greater good and the strength of America.
Cutting off the employment of excess government employees is one thing and should be done. Getting rid of government workers just to appease the tax structure or the sacrifice required is only cutting off our nose to spite our face IMO. As Will notes, the people will not have private sector jobs to go to so productive citizens then become unproductive citizens and the merry-go-round keeps turning.
We need to continue the path we are on, fix the tax structure, cut the spending and lower the debt and end deficits before we consider ANY across the board tax cuts. It is indeed time for an economic patriotism akin to “Rosie the Riveter” who rolled up her sleeves and did what needed doing. In a hole this deep, there is no other sensible choice.
To #43 (Will): You said, “I’ve always adhered to the “pay as you go” model both personally and in business. I don’t like debt unless there is a realistic plan by which to pay it back.”
I salute you, sir, for your most excellent attitude towards debt. I wish that more of your liberal brethren thought similarly. I’ve heard far too often that the government should borrow even more money for even more stimulus spending. [After all, interest rates are super low now and will stay that way forever, right?] Your attitude is the better approach.
To #45 (Sandi): You said, “We need to continue the path we are on, fix the tax structure, cut the spending and lower the debt and end deficits before we consider ANY across the board tax cuts.” Um, why are you lecturing me on this? I don’t believe I’ve ever called for tax cuts on this blog. Indeed, I specifically argued against the payroll tax holiday and have argued for increasing the tax rate on long-term capital gains.
Please recall Luanne’s admonishment in comment #25: “Not all liberals are Democrats, not all conservatives are Republican, and not everyone belongs to a political party.” Just because Democrats are attached to government spending that is already too high and Republicans are attached to tax rates that are already too low doesn’t mean we must support one side or the other. We can criticize both.
Also… I’m curious. What does the government do to “run the nation and care for the greater good and the strength of America” that is not essential? After all, you disagreed with my call for stripping things down to the essentials, so there must be stuff going on that isn’t essential. What is it?
#34 – I have no problem acknowledging mistakes, Will, and I often do…just not on this site. Doing so would be a monumental waste of time.