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Chris OBrion, The Roanoke Times
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Nothing like exploiting a tragedy with a lie, eh O’brion?
I’m not sure what you mean by a lie, Hoo, but Chris felt it was important to respond to the shooting rather than draw a cartoon on a totally different subject when everyone is so focussed on this tragedy. Yes, it’s going to get an emotional reaction because the shooting is getting emotional reactions, as it should. Why shouldn’t he share his reaction?
Tasteless, inappropriate, embarrassing that this newspaper represents my hometown.
Then again, what do you expect from the RT?
Perhaps Mr. O’Brion should have drawn someone saying we should arm every 7 year old school student.
Or would the conservatives here find that offensive too?
2 – It’s a lie, Christina, because the implication is that NRA members are walking around casually worshiping their weapons, unconcerned about the tragedy in Connecticut.
I challenge Obrion to name a single NRA member so callous and unconcerned.
It’s a lie.
2 – Obrion’s only motive was to provoke a reaction (he succeeded, to give him his due). He doesn’t give any more of a rip about the people in Connecticut than the person in his cartoon.
See how easy it is to lie, with no motive other than to generate a reaction?
@7 89Hoo, I disagree. It seems Obrion is simply saying there are some people who love their guns as much as others love their children. I know some NRA member like this (although of course they would never want to see guns used like this).
6 – since no one – conservative or otherwise – has suggested arming seven-year olds, Scott, it would be just stupid. Not stupid and offensive.
Mr. O’Brion certainly wasted no time in exploiting a tragic situation with his gallows humor. Disappointing, yet by no means surprising.
I wish I could post what I was really thinking, but the ban-hammer would drop on my head in a nano-second.
Suffice it to say, that my disust in certain people is being reinforced.
The bad part is, if Conn. would have supported the NRA and allowed teachers to carry this might have been min. or not happened at all.
So I say to everyone, never know when this could happen, go get licensed and carry. It could be your life and yes even your’s Mr. Obrian that I save one day.Then instead of kissing the gun as you so proudly you post……
Pathetic. If an armed NRA member would have been in the immediate area there would have been far fewer casualties.
9 – BALONEY, Scott.
Pull this Christina. Pull this down now. Easily the most insensitive, heartless act I have ever seen by your paper. Now is not the time.
I can always count on the RT to sink to the occasion anytime a gratuitous and dishonest Liberal point can be made, but somewhow you managed to outdo yourselves on this one and and set a new low.
“Never let a crisis go to waste” – liberal motto, as expressed by Rahm Emmanuel.
OBrion certainly wasted no time. Pathetic.
You are a worthless heartless newspaper that cares nothing for society.
Brandon I totaly agree. This has got to be the most tastless and heartless thing I have ever seen, and yet approved by the R.T.
Adding to my #18…I’m equally disgusted, actually moreso, with the Roanoke Times for exploiting this tragedy to make political points.
OBrion’s pathetic excuse for a cartoon was the act of one person. The decision to publish it was a decision made by an editorial board. Shameful and pathetic.
I have posted this comic on my facebook. Wow have I gotton a lot of hits about hateful roanoke times. This could be a disaster for this paper if it gets far enough around.
Shameful! I and many others will no longer subscribe to this paper. Is this the reaction you were looking for?
As tasteless and poorly thought out on the part of the RT editorial board the posting of this cartoon is at this particular point in time, I have to point out that prohibiting such would be a violation of the First Amendment guaranteeing Free Speech.
That would be just as much an abomination in many people’s eyes as any restriction of the 2nd Amendment.
I agree with many of the posts regarding the poor timing but I have to defend on the basis of the amendment.
HOWEVER…to the RT Editorial Board: I would expect greater professional and moral treatment of a story than that which you have demonstrated here. If I owned that paper, each of those who allowed this cartoon to be printed at this time, with emphasis on “at this time” would be seeking employment elsewhere immediately and summarily.
I’m going to home and kiss my wife and my little girl. I apologize to all for my tone, though I stand by what I wrote.
AMEN WIll on the last paragraph….
The First Amendment prohibits the government from censoring speech, not newspapers. They are free to exercise discretion. Just as a bar owner can toss out someone who is loud, offensive and obnoxious.
Ya’ll are a bunch of nuts! You don’t like the content of a cartoon so you shout the internet equivalent of shut-up. Take it out down you say? I say leave it up. You’re no better than those Muslim that go insane when someone draws a cartoon of Muhammed. There’s a lot of pathetic at this message board but it’s not OBrion and it’s not the RT.
Grow a backbone you people.
And JSwift you’re blatantly wrong about some NRA concealed carry person being able to end this. The guy had body armor. And research shows unless you specifically train for this type of thing people are as likely as not to freeze in threatening situation. I’m reading a book called THE UNTHINKABLE: WHO SURVIVES WHEN DISASTER STRIKES AND WHY. Arming the population and just assuming people will come to the rescue is just stupid. You need continual training in these scenarios so muscle memory takes over because even trained professionals panic.
Sorry, forgot the links to the book.
I think that the facts not only support the cartoon, it is precisely the time to put it up. People sitting in safety reading and responding to a blog DO need to be made to think. Think what this tragedy is a symptom of. I will add, that my distrust in certain people is being reinforced, mightily. Even a cursory knowledge of the gun control debate knows that no matter the collateral damage the NRA has one focus and one focus only, for us to leave their guns alone.
You let me know when the NRA or VCDL spends one dime on the research to see what causes this mass violence as people decide to go out in a “blaze of glory”.
You let me know when the NRA or VCDL does one PSA that fights the gun culture and the use of guns to solve problems.
You let me know when the NRA or VCDL backs more funding for (or raises money for) mental health screenings and calls for intervention BEFORE these tragedies occur.
The people who exploited the Benghazi tragedy immediately and thereafter to make political points have a lot of nerve decrying this cartoon too.
The Roanoke Times nor Roanoke.com is here to placate you.
Right on Chris OBrion, I consider you 10 feet tall right now sir!
This cartoon published only a few hours after the young victims tragically lost their lives is tasteless, self-serving, insensitive, and lacks class. Clearly, anyone who guns down children is mentally ill. And clearly, the artist and RT will use any opportunity to push an agenda and make a buck, yea Chris?
People that make cartoons at a time like this have no heart or concern for all these precious children. It could not happen at a worst time. Right at Christmas time. I feel so bad for all the families that lost love ones. Taking guns away is not the answer. Anyone that would do such a terrible thing will always find weapons. To take guns away is to take protection from the innocent.
I have sat through 16 hours of gun safety class that are sanctioned by the NRA and the one thing they constantly beat into our head is SAFETY, SAFETY, and SAFETY. How many of you have sat through a gun safety class?
I’m sure there are NRA members who are shocked and disgusted by this nutjob who chose to use a weapon to unleash his anger and target the innocent children and adults who had absolutely nothing to do with this nutjob.
There is absolutely NO WAY this society can predict this kind of event could unfold unless we live in a society like in the movie Minority Report where even thinking of hurting somebody lands people in jail.
NRA exist to also provide gun safety educations. One reason why they charge for class is to fund training on how to properly use the gun, how to treat it with RESPECT (gasp, a word that you would never hear from the media), and they cannot stress the importance of personal responsibility with carrying a handgun.
I personally have a license to carry a concealed weapon, but there is one thing that I have not decided to do, and that is to actually carry the weapon on my person. Why? Because I KNOW IT IS A LIFE-ALTERING RISK I will carry with me every time I step out of the door of my house.
If you people want guns to be gone, I suggest that police officers, state troopers, and the military don’t carry guns at all then.
sandi your post makes no sense this cartoon was a blatant attack stating that the NRA supports the murder of these children so if you support the cartoon thing you are supporting the murder of these children all I can say is this cartoon has went all over Facebook the Roanoke Times could be in financial trouble with this is all done
I have no doubt that those who chose to publish this despicable cartoon at this time will go home this evening proud of themselves.
And to those who defend them, I have nothing but pity.
I see the gun advocates jumping to their usual conclusions. Who has asked for guns to be banned? But I will freely tell you this. If taking your guns away would have prevented those babies from being killed today, or prevent the next such senseless act, I would use every ounce of my being to accomplish that.
NO ONE believes getting rid of guns is the answer and I do not think anyone has called for that. Not the Roanoke Times, not the RTEB and not Chris OBrion.
Your over-reaction says your paranoia is in full alert. We are not coming for your guns. But you might want to consider what your calls for looser and looser gun availability and carry might have wrought.
Trevor, I am happy to hear of your training, and I thank you for doing that. I was speaking with an Iraq veteran the other day and he assured me that most people who carry are as likely to be killed drawing their weapon as not. Few people have the training needed to react under literal gun fire. In your mind is always different than the real thing. And did you know that in Virginia, you can get a Concealed Carry Permit in no time, over the internet, even if you have never touched a gun, thanks to the VCDL.
I cannot help it if you all are willing to read the cartoon differently than it clearly intends. You have it totally wrong Herb. Totally.
Michael, save your pity for people who need it.
I’m sure when the inevitable calls for gun control (which will not stop these tragedies)are voiced, the NRA will be there to fight them. Like it or not, there is truth to the cartoon. It’s telling that the ones protesting the cartoon’s timing are the ones supporting the NRA!
#38 – “Like it or not, there is truth to the cartoon.”
No, Blue John, there isn’t. People who believe in the right to own guns had nothing to do with this tragedy.
” It’s telling that the ones protesting the cartoon’s timing are the ones supporting the NRA!”
No, Blue John, it’s telling that those who are protesting the cartoon’s timing are those who have a sense of decency and respect for those affected by this horrible, horrible event.
#39 – “No, Blue John, it’s telling that those who are protesting the cartoon’s timing are those who have a sense of decency and respect for those affected by this horrible, horrible event.”
Those affected by this horrible, horrible event are the victims of gun violence. You’re asking us to have a sense of decency and respect for the NRA, not the victims of gun violence. There is a huge difference.
Tell me honestly, which side of the issue do you think the victim’s families would take right now and then ask yourself again which side we’re showing respect for.
There are countless times that I’ve agreed with you on numerous topics…but on this particular matter, you’re plain wrong.
There is indeed a time and place for this discussion and no doubt there will be much to come in the future; however, the cartoon really does nothing to advance the discussion that needs to take place. In fact by the very nature of it, people will focus on the cartoon itself rather than the underlying need for the underlying discussion in the first place.
I feel that a boundary of moral decency was crossed at a very inappropriate time.
Sadly, the discussion that really should have taken place is too late. I would have been much more moved had the cartoon shown someone hugging their child a little tighter.
I think that the RT has done damage to themselves, while not necessarily irreparable, certainly it could have been handled more professionally and with greater dignity and respect for those directly impacted by the tragedy.
Tell me Michael, when would be a good time to publish the cartoon? Keep in mind the rights and freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution.
NOTHING in that cartoon lacks a “sense of decency and respect for those affected by this horrible, horrible event”. The disrespect for the NRA is earned, well earned and people who believe so powerfully in the right to own and carry guns that they make it easier for people who should not have guns to get them ARE part of the problem.
@#40 “Tell me honestly, which side of the issue do you think the victim’s families would take right now…”
I seriously doubt they give a rip right now, and would be extremely upset and offended if asked. Maybe after they’ve had the opportunity to make funeral arrangements for their children they’ll be able to arrange their thoughts enough to form an opinion about the politics of what just happened.
Will, you are free to disagree with me, I just do not see what it is you see. I see nothing in that cartoon that lacks “dignity and respect for those directly impacted by the tragedy”, only the NRA. You know as well as I do, the moment this pain fades, the same old defensive and unhelpful rhetoric will flow and nothing will change.
We are all enraged at this senseless act and calling out the NRA both for their actions and what we know will be their future actions is totally part of the reason this continues to happen. It is the old adage, you are either part of the problem or part of the solution. The NRA is not part of the solution.
#40 – “You’re asking us to have a sense of decency and respect for the NRA, not the victims of gun violence.”
Really, Scott? Do you really think that’s what I’m asking?
I wish I could respond truthfully, but again, the fear of getting banned is hanging over my head.
#42 – “Tell me Michael, when would be a good time to publish the cartoon? Keep in mind the rights and freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution.”
Certainly not within hours of such an horrific event. And trust me, BJ, unlike many here, I have the utmost respect for the rights and freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution…no need to tell me to keep them in mind.
Then Sandi, if the dialogue goes silent after the passing of a few weeks..the the fault rests with people like you and me who let it fade away.
#47 – Indeed, Will, a dialog is desperately needed.
Unfortunately, the Conservative viewpoint will quickly be shut out with insults and denigration, instead of being taken into serious consideration.
So yes, it will fade away. But not because the Left let it go away through silence…but because they refused to consider the views of others.
Michael…the views of liberals like myself will be degraded and castigated just as quickly by conservatives. Reasonable discussion will not happen until the loud mouths on both sides are muzzled to a degree so that reasonable dialogue from both sides can take place
I see that most Virginians disagree with the cartoon in today’s paper. They are not concerned that the clever cartoon draws attention to their ridiculous contention that the 2nd amendment was meant to allow random killings under the guise of protected rights. Perhaps some Virginians will postulate that if the teachers had guns they could have stopped this slaughter. YAY
“Certainly not within hours of such an horrific event. And trust me, BJ, unlike many here, I have the utmost respect for the rights and freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution…no need to tell me to keep them in mind.”
As long as they agree with your viewpoint and timeline, correct?
Absolutely inappropriate! Not today…..keep the political views away on the same day as this awful tragedy! I am ashamed of Mr O’Brion and even more ashamed of the Roanoke Times for allowing it. You have lost me completely as a patron!
#49 – “Reasonable discussion will not happen until the loud mouths on both sides are muzzled to a degree so that reasonable dialogue from both sides can take place”
Never gonna happen, Will.
I don’t believe in muzzling anyone. Ignore them, yes, but they do have a right to say what they want.
This cartoon is beyond inappropriate. In my personal opinion it is inexcusable, despicable, shameful display of an agenda. The illustrator obviously shows no concern or sympathy for the victims and their families. And….in the very least it demonstrates the epitome of disrespect. Shame on you Chris O’Brion!
#51 – “As long as they agree with your viewpoint and timeline, correct?”
Not at all, BJ.
I’m all for listening and accepting other views.
Timeline? You got me. Publishing this cartoon when they did made the RT staff look insensitive, and I’m sure they’re proud of it. In fact, I await the future editorial saying how “cutting edge” they are by publishing such a cartoon to encourage discussion among their readership…when in fact they were simply trolling to stir up the puddin’.
the left will waste no time in trying to gain from this tragedy.
How exactly could we “gain from this tragedy”? This tragedy is about nothing but loss. And nothing will come of it. Do you call that a “win” for the right? Then how will we “gain from this tragedy”?
very poor taste. should not even be allow to stay up.
Guns don’t kill people, bullets do. Ban bullets.
Freedom of speech is one thing. It’s a good thing. But timing & good taste should also factor in.
Shame on the cartoonist for the timing of this poorly crafted subject & shame on the paper for publishing it.
How will you gain from this terrible thing. That is very easily explained Sandi. Not more then 2 hrs after this did a NY congresswomen call for stricter gun laws and even in Obama’s tearful speech,which for the first time i really felt for our president, did he mention gun laws. Thats how. Peolpe will get guns ni matter what. The problem lies with criminals not respsonsible owners. I dont know how you can make them any tighter then hurting the responsible owner.
To those offended-How long is it acceptable to wait after a horrific act like this to discuss it? I am not overly offended by the cartoon, but then I could give a damn about the NRA or any other political group.
That events like this are becoming routine in our country is hard to deny. The last “big one” was in Colorado in July. If terrorists had done this millions-hell maybe billions would be spent to stop the next one from happening. Law bsed on tragedies tend to be poor ones and I am advocating nothing in particular, but this is becoming a national crisis. To pretend otherwise is to deny reality.
I cannot find adequate civilized words to describe my disgust with this “cartoon” or with the paper in general. Hopefully, this will awaken the public to realize how callous the media is when they can use a horrific tragedy such as occurred yesterday in Newtown, Ct. to propagate their own political agendas. People are suffering from yesterdays event but even during that time this newspaper does not miss an opportunity to promote its own agenda.
This is the Roanoke Valley’s finest? I think not! I did not think it possible to think any less of this newspaper than I did; but, you’ve proven me wrong.
Actually, the precipitating event was the Mall shooting days after taking my grand daughters to Roanoke Mall for Christmas exhibits. I have been actively researching Concealed Carry holsters so I can use my CCP and carry my little one (9mm) close and near to protect my grandchildren when out with them in crowded places. As to RTWN using using every opportunity to promote its political agenda – well a postmodern nihilistic worldview sees politics as preeminent, truth a mere construct of those in power and life ultimately without meaning or purpose. A chance to ridicule, belittle and demean opponents cannot be missed even while a stunned nation mourns the evil murder of children.
#61..”To those offended-How long is it acceptable to wait after a horrific act like this to discuss it? I am not overly offended by the cartoon, but then I could give a damn about the NRA or any other political group….”
I agree…At the rate such which events like this are occurring there will never been enough time between them to be deemed “appropriate”.
The discussion on the topic of guns follows a predictable pattern.
1. time not right, too close to the event.
2. Every citizen needs to be armed
3. Take away cars, they too kill people (btw, if you going to pick a vehicle for this comparison don’t pick a Honda Civic, pick a military tank… it does not kill, its the person manning the tank and its built for protection and killing.)
4.The next “big crisis” is the topic of moment…Gun discussion never happens
5. Rinse and repeat.
#63 – Good for you for wanting to protect your family, TB!
Unfortunately, Valley View mall prohibits guns on its property.
oops, the editors are NOT offering an apology
This is the most disgusting thing I have ever seen in my life. Now, while mothers have been robbed of their children, and children who witnessed this robbed of their innocence, and babies robbed their future, is not the time for you to voice your political agenda. Do you not have any class? This obviously shows you have no heart.
We have subscribed to this paper since 1978.. Today’s cartoon is very offensive to my wife and I. We will not renew our subscription. We are not members of the NRA and do not own a handgun. Shame on your paper.
#61-I agree with you. We’re told we can’t discuss any public policy implications in the immediate aftermath of one of these events. Then, it’s just forgotten again. I sadly believe that no meaningful changes will result from this and the cycle will start over again. I also agree 100% that if had this exact same event been committed by a terrorist, those condenming any discussion of the public policy implications would be ready to declare war today.
#65 I do not intend to “carry” where rules/laws prohibit doing so. But there are lots of crowded places. Also, hope and pray to never have to actively protect my family.
Well, Chris…just continue your worriment….Guns are our past, our present, and I gar-ron-tee, will be in our future…If you hate it so bad, leave…you won`t be missed.
45…Sandi, please explain how the NRA is “part of the problem.”
#66 – “oops, the editors are NOT offering an apology”
Of course not. Did you really think they would?
All this outrage over a cartoon. Can’t we divert some of it to the event itself? The good, decent law-abiding gun owners need to realize that they are part of the problem. The bad guys have the same easy access to guns you do. Go ahead, have your guns. But you should also have a good reason for owning one, a rigorous background check, recertification, safety devices and training, training, training. Owning a gun, like driving, should be a privilege not a right. If it were, a confirmed anti-gun person like me would have much more respect for you and your opinions.
#74 – The outrage is not over a stupid cartoon, Betsy. It’s over the shameless agenda and lack of respect and compassion the RT staff showed by publishing it as soon as they did.
Good job, Chris, and Christina. Gun supporters are busy shouting out their usual line that we shouldn’t “politicize” this event by talking about gun regulations. But if a drunken driver with four DUIs under his belt had plowed into a school bus and killed this many children, who would say that talking about drunken driving laws should be off limits?
It’s time to reject the Cult of the Gun and talk – now – about how we can keep weapons out of the wrong hands and other steps we can take to prevent such tragedies, or at least prevent them from happening with such sickening regularity.
What poor taste. Absolutely shows a lack of class and dignity. While families have been destroyed The Roanoke Times chooses to post this cartoon. Actions like this are why most young people I know no.longer subscribe to this paper. You should be ashamed for not respecting those affected by this violence.
laksgklagh;kng That was the sound of me throwing up my breakfast. This is absolutely disgusting.
Betsy, People have had there heads cut off over cartoons. This “bad guy” stole his guns. So, owning a gun should be a privilege not a right? Could we not associate this with voting also? Shouldn’t someone have a rigorous background check, recertification and training, training, training before voting (check your Constitution before flaming back that voting in a Presidential election is a right).
Study after study after study by both sides of the issue have proven guns don’t kill people, people kill people.
“The good, decent law-abiding gun owners need to realize that they are part of the problem.” Murder is not “law abiding”. “A drunk driver with 4 DUI’s under his belt” is also at least four times a law breaker. The “bad guy” stole the guns and you two want to punish law abiding gun owners.
Guns are no more prevalent today, less actually, than in past years but “no fault divorce”, near addiction to violent tv, movies and video games, widespread confusion to outright denial of evil, morality & values, decadent culture, family dis-integration, declining religious commitment and a therapeutic insanity that disguises and diminishes evil as “sickness”, mental impairment or emotional distress…. all of these cultural sicknesses are rapidly increasing.
TB, do you have any statistics on the statement that “Guns are no more prevalent today, less actually”? I was not aware of that. All I hear from gun advocates is how many more guns have been sold since President Obama was elected, as if that was a point of pride.
I will agree that much of the mental anguish that drives a person to murder might be attributable to some of our mores changing, but expecting unhappy parents to “stay together” is also not good for children. Who is it that you believe is offering “widespread confusion to outright denial of evil morality & values, decadent culture, family dis-integration, declining religious commitment”? I see groups working on these all the time. Do you support forced “religious commitment”? Do you think evil is not mental illness?
Could it also be that the lack of mental health services for children and adults bears some blame? Could it be our lack of outreach and affordable beds for those who are obviously (and not obviously) suffering some impairment? Do you know that prison is the largest depository of the mentally ill? And that they eventually are released back into society?
I agree this is the result of our failure, I just do not think all of the failures you list are the real problem.
Incredibly disgusting. The Roanoke Times should be so ashamed that they stand behind this horrific image. Their so blinded by a bias they can’t even pull together in a tragic time.
@Herb #60 “The problem lies with criminals not respsonsible owners.”
Eric Harris, Dylan Klebold, Seung-Hui Cho, James E. Holmes and Adam Lanza were not criminals prior to their hororific events.
So I think we should focus elsewhere in which the problem lies, for example,Dan Radmacher #76 makes a sensible comment “– about how we can keep weapons out of the wrong hands and other steps we can take to prevent such tragedies, or at least prevent them from happening with such sickening regularity.” Now what’s wrong with this?
I think this cartoon is proof that the Roanoke Times is more than simply trying for us to “pull together in a tragic time”. Acknowledging the reality of the gun culture does nothing to diminish the horror of this incident. In fact, it shows the stark battle we face. I cannot fathom why so many cannot see that.
Sandi: NO! Forced religious commitment is an oxymoron. True religious commitment, by this I mean Biblical Christianity, is a matter of the heart. All politics is downstream from culture which doesn’t mean politics is pointless but instead, because a representative democracy reflects the will of the people that root causes are found in our hearts and minds. The transforming of hearts and minds is accomplished in families, local churches
and synagogues, voluntary associations, communities, civic groups, religious associations… not in the halls of Congress or court chambers. Go to The Gospel Coalition, TGC, and read the blog post from yesterday by entitled A Day of Hatred by Jen Wilkin. In fact read all of the blog posts about New Town. I hope they shed some light on how we should mourn, grieve, pray and hope in the light of such evil Maranatha- Come Lord Jesus!
This cartoon offends owing to its ability to nail what we are thinkingyet are afraid to say out loud.we as a nation have lost the ability to think, debate disagree and compromise. So we prefer to be outraged and express our I.ability to think by writing in soundbites. Read the Lincoln – Douglas debates and compare to these attitudes of outrage over an editorial. The threat is loss of the ability to reason, not of the ability to shoot.
The Times writers can print whatever they want to as long as the libel envelope is not breached. There is no law prohibiting tasteless publications. When propaganda minister Dan left the Times in order to increase the unemployment rate in the coalfields, I hoped that young Ms. Nuckols would move the pendulum of the RTEB just a little toward the center but that has turned out to be wishful thinking. An occasional random act of objectivity is not too much to hope for. Or is it?
This is no more distasteful than, say, claiming that it’s the result of “God being taken out of schools.” I also find this cartoon to be quite true in the sense that gun lovers are probably worrying right now about their guns being taken away because of this tragedy and the others like it that we have had. In fact, if you look around online, I know for a fact you will find those exact sentiments being expressed. Finally, if we’re to enact gun control legislation in an effort to avoid these disgusting incidents in the future, we should look carefully at what other nations have been doing in this regard. America is unique among western nations for many reasons, one of them being our gun laws, another of them being our gun-related homicide rate.
Ok Gary, whats the answer. To many complaints pointing to the nra and responible owners. Like I tell my employees dont come to me with problems unless you have and ide or solution. I got tired of hearing cimplaints and not ONE answer. None.
Herb, what is the solution you have offered?
Sandi, i am not the one complaining you and Obrion are. So whaf is the solution besides all the complaining and whinning
Herb, I disagree that you have not complained.
You complained: “if Conn. would have supported the NRA and allowed teachers to carry this might have been min. or not happened at all“. Actually his mother was a gun owner and had access to several, they sure didn’t save her did they? Maybe if he had not gotten his hands on “her” guns, this would not have happened at all. If you had a child with any kind of problems would you allow them access to your guns?
You complained: “This has got to be the most tastless and heartless thing I have ever seen“. Why can you express your feelings but the RTEB or Chris OBrion should not?
You complained: “The problem lies with criminals not respsonsible owners.” But you offered not one solution.
You complained: “To many complaints pointing to the nra and responible owners“. But you offered not one solution.
Maybe you should offer those solutions you demand from your employees along with your own complaints before demanding them from others.
In the end, the NRA complains about and fights any effort at gun owner control without EVER offering any solutions to the mass shootings, even this one. If you think this is such a heinous thing and you think the RTEB and Chris OBrion should not have put out this cartoon, what is your solution? Does saying you are “not the one complaining” mean you think there is nothing to be done besides arming teachers? Really?
#2 Right Ms. Nuckols, RTEB……the Roanoke Times Emotional Board.
#24 Will, this has nothing to do with the 1st Amendment. O’Brion works for & publishes at the “discretion” of the RT(EB). It’s called…..editing.
I complained about the disgrace of the RTEB and Chris. obrion My solution fire them. i complained about teachers not being armed i say arm some .
You complained about guns period and have no solution. Like i said dont bring a complain unles you have a solution.
#76 How many “DUI’s” did Lanza’s mother have? How many he?
Please define the “Cult of the Gun”.
Other than what Conn. was/is already doing, how do you suggest we “keep weapoons out of the wrong hands”.
What “weapons” other than guns. Which type of guns?
“other steps we can take to prevent such tragedies, or at least prevent them from happening with such sickening regularity.” What “other steps”?
I remain unclear what “complaint” it is you believe I have made Herb. I assume you mean by agreeing with Chris OBrion on the NRA? I think that like any lobbying group they take gun advocacy to an extreme that hurts this nation. My specific case in point is the problems their efforts have caused the BATF.
“Some call it the “parade of ants”; others the “river of iron.” The Mexican government has estimated that 2,000 weapons are smuggled daily from the U.S. into Mexico. The ATF is hobbled in its effort to stop this flow. No federal statute outlaws firearms trafficking within the U.S., so agents must build cases using a patchwork of often toothless laws. For six years, due to Beltway politics, the bureau has gone without permanent leadership, neutered in its fight for funding and authority. The National Rifle Association has so successfully opposed a comprehensive electronic database of gun sales that the ATF’s congressional appropriation explicitly prohibits establishing one.”
The NRA fights every effort at gun people control for their own aggrandizement and my solution would be for this nation to stand up to them.
Sandi, your very first quest to me was what solution do i have. My point is you stated by agreeing with chris that more gun control is needed my question to you is what do you propose. You guys are quick with the tongue to complaine about gun control but short in yhe mibd on how to do it. There was nothing that coukd have stopped this guy except another gun in a teachers hand, nothing. so you gice ne your solution to gun contr that you so quickly say we need.
I cant stand trying to type on a phone. My last sent is supposed to read. So what is your solution to control you say we so badly need.
Wow, I see O’Brion truly hit a nerve with all the screeching and howling and gnashing of teeth in this thread.
“There was nothing that coukd have stopped this guy”
Ahhh yes, that good old cynicism. I’ve said this before, and I’ll say it again: It’s funny how America’s rightists label us more progressive folks as “defeatists” whenever we scoff at their claims that they can force Islamic countries to transform into U.S.-style democracies, but when it comes to such things as universal health care and gun control, it’s these same rightists who become the cynics that say nothing can be done.
In my never ending quest to be the catalyst for hits to the RT threads, here is my answer Herb. Bear in mind that I am not a legislator, lobbyist, or even an activist. I am just a blogger.
I support registration for every gun and tracking that requires guns stolen to be reported, guns traded, sold or gifted to also require background checks such that when someone without documentation is found with a gun, that alone is a crime and we can catch criminals before they commit a crime. Follow the gun and end at least some of the carnage.
I support the “Assault Weapons Ban” and the large magazine ban. With those already registered before the ban, allowed with the same caveats as above if they change hands.
I support a law that says that when a Restraining Order is issued, the police remove all guns from the premises and no guns can be purchased; same for anyone adjudicated as mentally ill or anyone who is institutionalized or diagnosed with certain mental illnesses until such situations are adjudicated as stable and no longer needing such precautions.
In that same vein, I support civil rights legislation that says such interventions cannot be used to discriminate against the people involved so that the stigma of getting help or being evaluated on some level does not ruin lives, the way a felony conviction does.
Our society has a vested interest in a mechanism knowing who has guns or access to guns when they have certain mental illnesses, domestic violence issues, criminal records or proven trails leading that way. Seldom is a crime the first signal of something wrong. We do not need to wait for a criminal to commit a crime, if merely being caught with a gun is a crime and a serious one.
My whole point is to “get tough” on the criminals and more closely watch the mentally ill, not to make gun ownership, self-defense, sport or enjoyment impossible for gun owners. There is no need for gun laws to prevent the law-abiding people from exercising their second amendment rights. There never has been. That has not been an actual goal for most of us, and certainly not an attainable one.
#103 – Registration tells those in power who has the guns and where to go to confiscate them.
I cannot fathom how people so afraid of and disdainful of their government can bear to live here.
Nor can I fathom how anyone can be so trusting of the government.
Just look at how well that worked out for the indians.
106 – I would also add the we are encouraged to trust the government to keep us safe…and that didn’t work out so well in Connecticut, which, by virtue of the government declaring the school a gun-free zone (see how effective that was?) isolated a whole set of victims who had no ability to defend themselves.
I do not trust the government, that is not remotely what I put my trust in.
I think it is convenient to blame the government for not having schools and public areas manned by armed security. I guess we want to be more like Israel? Is that really the solution you see here?
I still cannot credit thinking your guns are a cure all or last line of defense (or is it offense?) from the government. That kind of thinking is not rational IMO.
Then you would find Jefferson, Mason, Madison et al irrational, Sandi, as that was one of their intentions.
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Wed, 18 Dec 2013 14:06:31 +0000