Limit man-made laws; return to God’s
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By Tom Taylor
I am not a gun lover. I don’t even like them, especially the modern high-tech weapons that are ugly to look at and even uglier in what they can do.
But there’s something I would dislike even more. I’d hate to have been living in Russia in the 1930s when Stalin’s secret police prowled about in long, black cars called “black ravens.” Whenever a black raven entered a village or town, the people would cower in their homes, peering through the shutters to see at whose house the raven would stop, to see who was next to disappear into Stalin’s gulags. The people were defenseless. They had no weapons, no Second Amendment rights, no National Rifle Association.
Taylor, a novelist, lives in Roanoke. He is retired from Norfolk Southern.
February 6, 2013 - 6:14 AM
I see Tom Taylor is once again expressing his long-standing desire for America to become a theocracy. Look Tom, I’ve said this before, and keep on saying it again and again and again:
Google such terms as “Inquisition”, “Thirty Years War” and “St. Bartholomew’s Day Massacre” to learn just what sort of wonderful things can happen when the church rules the state.
Oh, and another thing: Americans once used the supposed “laws of god” to rationalize such things as slavery, Jim Crow, and the forceful displacement and massacres of the American Indians. Think about it.
This essay takes the idea that people will “cling to their guns and religion” to new depths. The scariest thing about Mr. Taylor’s essay is the number of people who actually think he’s right.
Sometimes you have to fight for what you stand for when it goes against the very fabric of what this nation was founded under, even if that means to the very last breath.
This argument that we should ‘return to God’s law’ suffers from one major flaw.
There is no God so there can be no God’s law.
Thats your opionion which your entitled to Scott. It is also my right to do whatever is neccessary along with millions of others to do what they have to do to protect our founding fathers dream. At all cost.
Scott M is exactly right. Taylor’s writing leaves the atheist and even others who believe in another god out in the cold.
However, I do agree with Taylor’s suspicion of the effects of the breakdown of the family unit, a million +/- annual abortions, ultra violent entertainment/video games on this nation/culture. Too many have been bitten and are now rabid, society has become coarse in too many ways.
Though nowhere near a majority, all you need are a few million crazed to continue what we’re enduring..the unthinkable is no longer.
Dear Steve, Mr. Withheld, Herb and Scott,
Thanks for caring enough about this subject to write a post. Yes, Steve, you are absolutely right when you point out the dangers of the church running the state; and I think we would all be well advised to guard against such a thing. That said, may I offer a few timid points in defense of my article.
First, the number of people murdered in the Spanish Inquisition, Salem witch trials, etc. while tragic, pales in comparison to the millions upon millions of people murdered in the last century by atheistic, socialist, governments who put man’s laws above God’s. Also, the Inquistitions, Crusades, etc. are all recognized as aberrations of the Christian religion, carried out by people who were only claiming the title. But the murders carried out by Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Kruschev, Pol Pot, etc., were the natural result of the evolutionist, Godless philosophy of those governments.
Second, no one wants a theocracy or a middle-ages style church/state. There’s not enough room here to adequately treat the subject. But if you’re interested and have the time, please go to my webpage where I’ve written an article that might clarify things. Go to http://www.iLuvgoodnovels.com. The first page is about my newest novel. Just click on the upper left link to go to the home page. At the home page, click on the link to the gallery of articles, then select “Why we owe our Liberties and Democracy to a Judeo-Christian heritage.” Thanks so much.
Tom, you wrote, “Second, no one wants a theocracy or a middle-ages style church/state.” No one wants “black ravens” either.
It’s all about evaluating risk. Is the risk to America and its people higher if we allow people to own and carry guns, without any kinds of registration or means of tracking them (add up the number of deaths there), or is the risk higher if we round up and destroy all the guns and thereby subject ourselves to the chance that a Stalinist type tyranny will evolve? When you look at it in this light, then what you’re really saying is that the occasional mass-killing is just part of the price we have to pay to secure our society against tyranny. Maybe that’s true, maybe we just have to accept it. The National Rifle Association seems to think so.
Your solution, however, really is to exert mind control on the population by turning it into a Christian theocracy. And while the loss of lives might not add up to something that reaches Holocaust-era proportions, the loss of individual freedom would be just as insidious. You seem to have completely forgotten that one of the main reasons people came to America was to escape your ideal government.
Finally, it’s just laughable to dismiss the Crusades as a one-off “aberration”. To the people who organized the Crusades they seemed completely consistent with their faith and therefore absolutely necessary.
I bet I know what would happen if the Catholic Church (just as an example of a major faith based organization) took over the US Government. The first thing they’d do is take away everyone’s guns.
@8 Mr. Taylor, I always appreciate the respectful tone you use at this forum even though we fundamentally disagree about the nature of the world.
I believe you’re begging the question when you claim the Inquisitions, Crusades, etc. were aberrations while saying the murders carried out by Stalin, et al are unavoidably parts of a naturalistic world view. Can’t I just as reasonably claim Stalin, et al, are recognized as aberrations of an atheist world view? After all, the Inquisition and Crusades were religious wars and persecutions. There is no requirement that wars or persecutions be done in order to be an atheist.
I think you’re confusing the issue by blaming atheism, etc. when it’s closer to the mark to say those with power and influence are human beings and thus corruptible. After all, someone in charge had to order the Crusades. Someone in power financed Columbus’s trip to the Americas thereby beginning the process of wiping out more than 20 million Native Americans through force of arms and disease. Someone in charge directed the armies of England during their civil war which was a struggle between the Catholics and Protestants.
But you’re basically making the argument that with no gods, men are free to do horrible things to each other. But as many people, including Sam Harris and Christopher Hitchens have pointed out, the same is true of the religious. Just ask Abraham who was ordered to murder his son (and almost did it!) and the 9/11 attackers (thought they were doing God’s work).
One other point that’s important. The actions of Stalin, et al, has nothing to do whether there is a god or not. The fact is, there are none.
I mean if there was a God, would those massacres have been allowed to take place? And if a God allowed them to take place, that god is unworthy or worship. But once we accept there are no gods, we can work together to insure no more mass killings occur irrespective of them being started by atheists or the religious.
Speaking of evolutionist, that reminds me. Darwin Day is the 12th. That is, Charles Darwin was born Feb. 12, 1809 and shares the exact same birth date as Abraham Lincoln.
I love this coincidence. Lincoln is the Great Emancipator for freeing the slaves and Darwin is another kind of emancipator. He emancipated our thoughts.
Mr. Taylor, you state “the murders carried out by Stalin, Hitler, Mao, Kruschev, Pol Pot, etc., were the natural result of the evolutionist, Godless philosophy of those governments.” This is historically inaccurate. Hitler was a Christian.
And there is no logical construct to support your claim that the actions of those brutal individuals can be attributed to their religious philosophies (or lack thereof where applicable). The millions of deaths under their regimes are more directly attributable to their sociopolitical and economic ideologies.
e william, a couple of quick points that may not be germane to the topic.
Saying Hitler was a Christian then forces one to define what is a Christian. There are times when he talked like and celebrated Christianity and times when he didn’t. I think it inaccurate to label him Christian because of what we think of as modern day American Christian. It’s probably more fair to say he was influenced by Christianity and most of his followers were (simply because most of the population of Germany was Christian in the American sense).
I think it amusing to note Stalin started off in Russian Orthodox seminary. But that was common. If you want some interesting reading, peruse these links to stories of the Russian Orthodox church. They’re turning into what I imagine Tom Taylor wants.
http://religionclause.blogspot.com/2012/04/russian-orthodox-church-responds-to.html
Also, the wealthy lifestyle of Patriarch Kirill has come under attack, including a blogger’s claim that Kirill wore a $40,000 wristwatch. A photo of Kirill wearing it was found on a Church website. The Church then airbrushed out the watch, but forgot to also airbrush its reflection in a polished oak table in a photo that went viral online.
http://religionclause.blogspot.com/2011/12/russian-local-prosecutor-attempting-to.html
http://religionclause.blogspot.com/2013/01/new-russian-law-mandates-religion.html
The Moscow Times reported Monday that Russian President Vladimir Putin has signed a new education law passed by the Russian Parliament that, among other things, makes mandatory in all schools a course in fundamentals of religion. The law takes effect on Sept. 1, 2013.
http://religionclause.blogspot.com/2013/01/russian-orthodox-head-urges-careful.html
…Ultimately 2 of the band members ended up with 2 year prison sentences. (See prior posting.) Kirill argued that the current small fine under Art. 5.26 of the Russian Code of Administrative Offenses for Insulting Religious Feelings of Citizens is not enough to indicate that society is serious about protecting believers….
http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2013/02/06/orthodox-church-should-have-more-control-over-russian-life-putin/
President Vladimir Putin has said the Orthodox Church should be given more say over family life, education and the armed forces in Russia, as he celebrated the leadership of its head Patriarch Kirill.
Faith runs deep in Russia after the fall of the officially atheist Soviet Union and Putin has looked to the largest religion in Russia for support since he began his third term as president after a wave of protests against his rule….
Putin’s relationship with the church has strengthened since band members of protest punk band Pussy Riot entered Russia’s Christ the Saviour Church last year and sang a vulgarity-laced song, urging the Virgin Mary to “throw Putin out”.
Without giving specifics, Putin said a “vulgar” understanding of secularism must be swept away to give the Church, and other religions, control over more aspects of Russian life.
#4 “Sometimes you have to fight for what you stand for” I’m sure the folks who used their Christian beliefs to justify such wonderful things as slavery, Jim Crow, repression of gays, plus the aforementioned Inquisition, Thirty Years War, and St. Bartholomew’s Day Massacre, felt exactly the same as you, Herb. Sorry, but being passionate about something doesn’t always make you right.
#6 “It is also my right to do whatever is neccessary along with millions of others to do what they have to do to protect our founding fathers dream. At all cost….” …and damn the consequences, right, Herb? Like I said: Being passionate doesn’t always make you right.
I have to wonder what “breakdown of the family unit, a million +/- annual abortions, ultra violent entertainment/video games” contributed to Stalin’s world view? Hitler’s? Idi Amin’s? The Roman Empire’s? The Crusades?
Perhaps we need to not compare feudal systems with modern democracies for a start and beyond that, we need to see where the real erosion of personal, state and national morality comes from. When we virtually exterminated the Native American population because we wanted this land for ourselves, where was our own moral imperative and Christian mission? When we used our military to enforce the pillage and plunder of the natural resources and peoples of other nations, gaining as they lost and even enslaving human beings, where was our own moral imperative and Christian mission?
According to many, our Christian heritage and mission makes us uniquely qualified to speak on the matters of history, human rights and morality. I do not see that as the reality we acted out. Not in the exploration of our own nation nor others.
What separates this nation from having the secret police take us out for non conformance is not the absence of a Hitler but the presence of our Constitution and a society that agrees to abide by our laws.
Since this whole thing is NOT about “taking guns” but about whether some of the guns in use should be, this whole piece is beyond specious IMO. The right to self defense is an established right that no one is trying to take away. Looking for Hitler instead of solutions is the easy way out. Claiming that God can fix what ails us has been around since the time of Moses, and that hasn’t happened yet either.
Briefly, the breakdown of familial and societal mores and norms HAS lead to the downfall of societies and empires. No, the Romans did not have x-box, but they did have lavish spectacles featuring death and mutilation. No, the feudal states did not have internet porn, but most royal houses were wracked with venereal diseases. Same sins, different forms.
@17 89Hoo, what? So having the Coliseum lead to the Roman “downfall”? The lascivious behavior of royalty lead to the extinction of royalty?
Besides the fact that Rome and Italy still exist as do kings and queens, this sounds like a chicken and egg problem. Did those behavior reflect the “downfall” or did they lead to it?
18 – well, it is a bit of chicken and egg, Scott, and no, the mere presence of the Colosseum did not lead to downfall. You are right on both counts.
The real commonality of all failed states is the lack of respect for individual liberties and freedoms. This is manifested in many ways, be it slaughter for sport (with victims whose crimes were usually against the state and not individuals), desensitization against violence and glorification of those who would destroy those individual liberties, lasciviousness that objectified women and denigrated them to second class citizens, the denial of life to the most innocent of individuals, slavery (be it to individuals or to the state), the theft of means of sustenance and prosperity (whether through serfdom or destruction of wealth).
All fallen empires have that in common. There are vast differences between the Roman Republic, the Roman Empire, the City of Rome and the country of Italy. The geographical, political boundaries that define the current nation-state has only the shape of the peninsula in common with the Roman Republic and Roman Empire.
The irony here is that God’s laws ARE man made.
E William: Your saying Hitler was a Christian was a bit of a shocker; and Scott M. correctly noted that saying this forces one to define what a Christian is. It would be better to let the seminal book of Christianity, the New Testament, provide that definition. It does so in a number of passages, beginning with the famous John 3:16 and basically ending with Christ’s invititation in Revelation 3:20. It can be effectively summarized and captured in the following prayer: “Jesus, Son of the living God, have mercy on me. I believe your death paid the penalty for my sins, I believe your resurrection proved you have the power to save me. I accept your free pardon. I accept you as the Lord of my life. Come in and live in me.”
I made that decision many years ago and can testify Christ has given me peace, purpose and an inner joy, with the promise of more to come in the next life. I wouldn’t trade Him for all the wealth of the world.
Oh yes, back to Hitler. Is there any evidence he ever made such a decision and acknowledged Christ as his Lord? His actions certainly indicate otherwise.
Not to answer for E. William, who is far more intelligent and capable than I, but Hitler himself made such “evidence”, in writing “Mein Kampf”:
“Hence today I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord [p. 60].”
In sad, dispirited truth, his words echo today…
“And so he tries systematically to lower the racial level by a continuous poisoning of individuals.
And in politics he begins to replace the idea of democracy by the dictatorship of the proletariat.
In the organized mass of Marxism he has found the weapon which lets him dispense with democracy and in its stead allows him to subjugate and govern the peoples with a dictatorial and brutal fist.
He works systematically for revolutionization in a twofold sense: economic and political.
Around peoples who offer too violent a resistance to attack from within he weaves a net of enemies, thanks to his international influence, incites them to war, and finally, if necessary, plants a flag of revolution on the very battlefields.
In economics he undermines the states until the social enterprises which have become unprofitable are taken from the state and subjected to his financial control.
In the political field he refuses the state the means for its self-preservation, destroys the foundations of all national self-maintenance and defense, destroys faith in the leadership, scoffs at its history and past, and drags everything that is truly great into the gutter.
Culturally, he contaminates art, literature, the theater, makes a mockery of natural feeling, overthrows all concepts of beauty and sublimity, of the noble and the good, and instead drags men down into the sphere of his own base nature.
Religion is ridiculed, ethics and morality represented as outmoded, until the last props of a nation in its struggle for existence in this world have fallen.”
May God have mercy, his propaganda lives on.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Holocaust/kampf.html
Thanks Sandi, that’s exactly what I was preparing…(and I dispute the claim I am far more intelligent and capable than you!)
Mr. Taylor, it is general knowledge among historians that Hitler was a Christian. You may attempt to define, or redefine, however you like, using Scripture, or any other historical text, what it means to be a “christian,” but the fact remains that Hitler claimed Christianity as his religion and largely as the basis for his actions. In the same vein, the Ku Klux Klan and Aryan Nations also claim to act in the name of Christianity, as does the Westboro Baptist Church.
Just to pick on the obvious here, Mr. Taylor, have you informed the millions of Christians around the world of this new litmus test for proving or offering “evidence” of their faith that you have offered here?
Sandi, are you making the case that Hitler was (or could have been) a Christian, that he is (or could be) with Christ in Heaven? That flies in the face of some of the other things you have written on here.
I do not know that Hitler (or anyone else) is or is not, and would never claim to know what was in his (or anyone else’s) heart; that is strictly between him and Christ. I’ve often said said that one of the beautiful things of Christ’s salvation is that is not a time limitation (at least here on Earth). There can be real and genuine deathbed and foxhole conversions. Only God can separate the genuine from the false.
With regards to people like Hitler, yes, his actions can convince us that he had not accepted Christ until the time he took his own life, as none of his actions were Christ-like, he had no remorse, and even the act of taking his own life was not in accordance with Christ’s teachings. What happened in his heart between the time he consumed the poison and died is anyone’s guess.
But back to the point…just because someone claims to be a Christian, or to be on a mission from God, or to be doing God’s will certainly doesn’t mean it is true. We have Christ’s instructions in the new covenant He made…and none of the things Hitler claimed to be doing in acting for Christ are justified in that covenant.
BINGO! Precisely, “just because someone claims to be a Christian, or to be on a mission from God, or to be doing God’s will certainly doesn’t mean it is true” THAT is the “case” I am making. But, who are we to say?
I have no idea what Hitler “was”, or was judged by God to be. I know what he claimed and what he felt he was serving. But if the evidence being accepted is what someone says or claims to believe, Hitler was a Christian. So are the folks at Westboro Baptist and many other offensive people who have claimed that their truth is THE truth and their faith is THE faith. but, who are we to say?
Were there people Hitler was “good” to? Were there people who believed in him and his mission? Were there people who saw the good in his demonization of the Jews? Are there people who see the good in the demonization of any group of people today? If you listen to the effort at demonization he goes to, it sounds eerily familiar even now. And chilling.
Personally, I am not nearly as worried about what makes a Hitler, or what God or Demon drives him, I am very worried about the people who believe the lies and propaganda of hate and demonization of the “them” that helps such hate succeed.
Does it serve anything to delve into the religious convictions of the evil people in history? Did Hitler torture and murder because he was Christian? Did Pol Pot torture and murder because he was atheist? Does scale alone matter? Were the Inquisitions driven by Christians? The Crusades? Leaving Hitler and others alone, there has been plenty of evil done under the Christian flag, and there still is.
Sandi I’m not trying to pick a fight or anything, I’m just trying to understand your position. I think I agree with what you’re saying, or at least I agree with what I think you’re saying. Earthly judgements are based on what happens here on earth, and by any reckoning, Hitler was an evil bastard, with no redemptive qualities, no matter how he tried to justify himself. I’ll leave eternal judgements to God, but if I were on Heaven’s admissions committee, he wouldn’t get my vote. Of course, I’d be hard-pressed to vote for myself, either.