2009.05.03
Discuss Trejbal's column on college protests
Tech students need a class in college protests
Tom Tancredo spoke at Virginia Tech on Monday, and there was not a hint of protest, not even a whiff of patchouli. For shame, Hokies. Young Americans for Freedom invited him. They are a right-wing group with chapters on many college campuses, though this is their first year at Tech. About three dozen people attended. Tancredo, for those who do not keep track of America's obscure, nativist ex-congressmen, has been traveling the country condemning multiculturalism, immigration and "people who don't want to be Americans." He hails from Colorado and sought the 2008 Republican nomination for president.
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Case in point
http://www.lafayette-online.com/purdue-news/2009/04/ccav-sjp-free-speech/
Liberal are allowed to protest while conservatives are not.
Comment by Henry — May 4, 2009 @ 9:27 am
Maybe people realized Tancredo for what he was and decided to show up and protest would only serve to embolden his message, whereas if he went largely ignored, his message would not be heard and he would eventually fade away. Truth be told, when people start ignoring the rantings of fringe people, they fade to oblivion and then become one of those "whatever happened to..." footnotes in history that people rarely remember. Save your energy for things and people that are worth it.
Comment by Other John — May 4, 2009 @ 9:39 am
Has anyone considered that the protests against a lot of the blow-hards only gives them more press and more people access to their message?
Comment by Danny — May 4, 2009 @ 9:39 am
I think an audience of 3 dozen at a school the size of Tech WAS a protest and a very civil one. There is no need to mount a vigorous, loud, in your face protest every time there is an insult to intelligence. We would all be worn out! Still, silence can be mistaken for acquiescence and Tancredo is an insult.
If the facts are as presented in Henry's link, that was a blatant mistake on the part of the University. We will never get anywhere when protests are not allowed, but we will also never get anywhere when protests are just loud, obnoxious and insulting. No group should be allowed to disrupt another's forum (without consequences) or cause a disturbance in furtherance of a protest of a protest.
Maybe we should have classes on how to protest civilly and on learning how to make a constructive argument.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — May 4, 2009 @ 9:45 am
OJ - You said it much better than my attempt!! I wouldn't have given this guy two seconds of my time, but now that it appeared here and he was given some attention, I've looked into who this guy is. And, in turn, gave him an extra hit on websites and such.... He doesn't deserve this attention... Let him fade away where he belongs...
Comment by Danny — May 4, 2009 @ 9:56 am
I sympathize with your sentiment, folks. Sometimes it is better to let fringe people just yell at a wall and then fade away. It's a tough line to walk, though, because some seemingly fringe people have followings and their terrible messages must be met head on lest they fester and grow. The trick is determining when it's appropriate to ignore and when it's appropriate to respond. We run into this question often in our editorial discussions.
Comment by C. Trejbal — May 4, 2009 @ 10:01 am
I am with Sandi on this...after reading this editorial, it struck me that an audience of 36 on a campus that size spoke volumes about the interest level Tancredo generated. He was preaching only to the faithful. The less said about him, the better.
Comment by Kristen — May 4, 2009 @ 10:10 am
The same thing works for both the loony left and the wacky right. As a great example of a lefty who has since faded to oblivion, when was the last time anyone heard from Cindy Sheehan? After her failed congressional bid, I don't remember any national attention...though it was already waning by the time she hit that point and tried to challenge (Pelosi?) for a seat in the House. Hadn't heard a peep from her now in nearly a year, but she was the media darling for a long time before people realized she was hurting the overall cause more than anything. Give a person an outlet, and they'll use it as long as they stay in the media. Take that away so they onyl speak to a handful of their fellow nutbags, and they'll lose any semblence of relevance they once had and no longer be of interest. Then, maybe in 10 years, we'll find out they wrote a memoir or something when they do a book signing and have 2 people attend.
Comment by Other John — May 4, 2009 @ 10:13 am
Protests are allowed but only protests that follow the Establishment's beliefs. That why Purdue's admins were caught with their pants down. They would never dream that someone would oppose their view on Palestine. When someone did oppose it, they viewed that opposition as a disruption rather than a protest. The violence against Tancredo was the same way. If a conservative group had done the same at a gay rights event, the punishmsnt would be a lot worse. The Left has been given so much leeway in their protests that they now view violence as justified. Smashing a Starbucks window while wearing a mask is considered "protest" by many on the Left.
Nowadays, there is a thin line between protest and what the Left calls "Hate". It all depends on where you fall on the political line. Could speech against homosexuality ever become illegal? It sure has in Canada and Europe. The power of the police state could be used against those who disagree with the allowed opinions by labeling disagreement as "Hate".
Comment by Henry — May 4, 2009 @ 10:23 am
Then why, Henry, were there not people actively protesting Tancredo at VT? Higher education is very left-leaning in their ranks (and VT is definitely no different), so that line of logic does not seem to be universal.
Comment by Other John — May 4, 2009 @ 10:31 am
Violence against Tancredo? He barely rated a yawn.
As for the so-called "oppression" of the "convervative" students in that article, there was no supporting material for the accusation beyond the proclamations of the group themselves.
Comment by Kristen — May 4, 2009 @ 10:39 am
The Tancredo violence happened at UNC.
VT is not a very liberal campus. Many agro engineering schools are not.
Kristen
I doubt the administration is going to accuse themselves of bias. They don't see it.
Comment by Henry — May 4, 2009 @ 10:56 am
Sorry, Other John, we part ways on Cindy Sheehan. If you want to rail against wackos like, Joe the Plumber, Tancredo, ELF, or Glen Beck, I got your back, but Cindy Sheehan fighting against a stupid war and it's propaganda after losing her son to it, is not a good or fair example of a nut job in my opinion. That some Americans so despised that sad woman and her way of coping with grief pales in comparison to some of the true loons without any cause that are out there. You may not have agreed with her tactics (or more correctly the people who used her for theirs), but she had a legitimate loss and a legitimate beef. Please rethink that one, I beg you.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — May 4, 2009 @ 11:04 am
UNC has a very well-known Journalism school...
Comment by Other John — May 4, 2009 @ 11:10 am
Sandi, I have always sympathized with her losses and her general cause, but when she got the national media attention, I thought she started going off the deep end with her message (though, you may correctly have pointed out that others used her for their gain and this may be more their making than hers), and that she lost her effectiveness of reaching political moderates and non-liberals. I was very turned off by things she did (again, maybe it was more the handlers than her in retrospect since you mention a valid point), in much the same fashion of folks like Beck, Limbaugh, Hannity, Peta, etc. I just wound up ignoring her like those other folks I mentioned once I decided that her original message was taking a backseat to her attention-getting. I may have to rethink that one, because for whatever reason, I didn't account for the possibility that it might not have been Cindy herself that was doing all the wacky things that came to be attributed to her. Hmmm.
Comment by Other John — May 4, 2009 @ 11:23 am
If I lost my son (who is precious beyond measure to me) to any such cause or action, you can bet, I would make her look like a piker! As a mother, I understand (and therefore excuse) her actions far better than Joe the self-aggrandizing plumber, Glen Beck, ELF, or any of the other true wackos out there.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — May 4, 2009 @ 12:08 pm
I'll grant you that I gave her more leeway initially than the other folks you mentioned, since there was a real loss involved, and anyone who endures something like that gets a benefit of the doubt from me early on. I just got the distinct feeling that after a while, it became more of a "look at me" thing than a "remember my son, who died in this war" thing. That's when I started wondering what she was working to accomplish.
Comment by Other John — May 4, 2009 @ 12:18 pm
Sandi
Cindy Sheehan was tossed under the bus by the Democrats when she decided to protest Hillary's Iraq vote and ran against Nancy Pelosi. She was a political pawn used by the Democrats to attack the Republicans until she became a nuisance to them. Now she is persona non grata.
Comment by Henry — May 4, 2009 @ 1:23 pm
I believe I already acknowledged that she was used by people for their own ends, but thanks for that clarification in case anyone thought I meant the Conservative war mongers were using her for anything other than target practice. I don't think the people who demonized a grieving mother are less guilty than those who used her, but to each their own. I do not fault her for her efforts because I cannot imagine the pain she was and remains in. For me that distinction makes her different than Glen Beck or Rush or Garafalo, ELF & the left wing nut jobs who are comparable. If you see no distinction, that is your choice as well.
Comment by Sandi Saunders — May 4, 2009 @ 1:56 pm
For public figures with controversial views, there is no such thing as bad publicity. Any attention is welcome, especially a protest. I would like to think that VT students by and large understand this and simply protested the most effective way they can...by not protesting. But in reality, it's much more likely that they are all busy with end-of-the-semester work and simply didn't care enough to show up, or, more likely, never heard of the guy.
Comment by NRJMike — May 7, 2009 @ 8:58 am
Tech students are some of the most tolerant in the world. They also respect each other's viewpoints and take the time to understand other views - something seriously lacking in most "us vs. them" campuses. VT students are more intelligent than that and should be praised, rather than condemned, for their actions.
As a graduate of VT, I can tell you that the students here are passionate. Passionate about being grateful for life and all they have been given. We are also grateful that those with differing views can co-exist in a peaceful and respectful environment.
Comment by Tina in Virginia — May 14, 2009 @ 11:40 pm
Protesting would cut into drinking time. Hand out cheap beer and they would show up in droves and make it an event. Protesting to voice an informed opinion,, you give the kids here too much credit.
Comment by MikeC — May 27, 2009 @ 4:12 pm