2009.08.13
What's in your dog's bowl?
Blog reader Claren made a great suggestion that we open up a discussion about doggy nutrition.
Next week I have a lunch interview with a woman who is starting her dog on a raw diet. She told me her vet recommended it in light of the problems in recent years with commercial dog food. This will be the topic of an upcoming Happy Wag column.
I have thought about doing this for my dogs, but the whole idea of raw meat scares me and I know I have not done enough research yet to make an informed decision.
I feel like I would also need to do a proper analysis on how to budget for feeding three dogs a homemade diet. Would the cost be prohibitive or would the additional money invested in better-grade food be offset by savings in vet bills and improved overall health?
We feed our dogs a mix Science Diet Sensitive Stomach and Small Bites kibble and little "noms" of table food, including cooked white meat poultry and fish, cooked and raw veggies and raw berries. We try to keep bread scraps to a minimum - although they love bread as much as I do.
Dexter is currently taking an antibiotic that we hide in his kibble or immerse in peanut butter that he licks off our fingers. In the winter I bake them cookies from a doggy recipe book, and they are very fond of Mother Hubbard and Paul Newman organic treats.
Probably not exactly a healthy diet, now that I see it in writing. If it sounds like my pack eats all day, they do not. We feed them one bowl of food a day, and snacks are bite sized and spaced out throughout the day. I call Stormy my sous chef because he hangs out with me in the kitchen while I cook dinner waiting for tidbits to get tossed his way. He likes the raw berries and veggies way more than the greyhounds do.
All three are in perfect weight range for their breeds and heights. They get lots of exercise and have no known food allergies.
I must admit that I wonder what commercial dog food has really done to the digestive systems of dogs over the years. It seems like when I was growing up, way back in the 1970s, you could toss almost anything even remotely edible to the dog and she'd happily scarf it down and never get sick. Now just changing to a different formula of kibble made by the same manufacturer can cause a dog to get violently ill.
What do you feed your dogs and how did you arrive at those choices? What has your vet advised, and how much do you pay attention to news about dog food and dog nutrition? If you have rants or raves about commercial dog food, raw diets or homemade dog food, please share.
I have 2 very energetic pups - both weigh about 20 lbs, our vet says they have exceptional coats and are extremely healthy. We feed them both Pedigree Small Bites. They love it! Leela we adopted from Floyd County Humane Society as a puppy and she will eat anything and everything, even bumblebees in yard- despite having been stung on the lip twice! Baxter, however, we adopted from the Montgomery County Pound when he was about 1.5 years, and had been picked up as a stray - they believe he had been in the wild for about a month or more judging by how many ticks & tick scars he had. He has proved to be a very finicky eater (probably bc we won't let him hunt the birds and squirrels in our yard). We often have to entice him to his bowl by perhaps mixing in some scraps (chicken, fish, rice, or scrambled eggs)or sometimes just pouring rice broth over his food (and Leela's too, bc she will get quite jealous!). Neither of our dogs have ever gotten ill from eating scraps or different brands of dog food (which they will often eat on play dates at relative's houses). I attribute this to Baxter having developed an iron stomach from his carnivorous diet in the wild (he's quite the hunter!) and Leela's to pure obstinacy. However, my brother has two purebred dogs that he feeds a strict Iams diet and no scraps, and they do get incredibly sick if they have even a bite or two of our Pedigree. So, I'm not sure if maybe it's that my mutt's have a stronger digestive track, or if maybe it has to do with what you feed them from pups to adults?
Comment by Julie Ann — August 13, 2009 @ 11:31 am
I also meant to add, that I've never tried feeding them raw meat and I admit the idea scares me. As far as raw vegetables, they love carrots and green beans!
Comment by Julie Ann — August 13, 2009 @ 11:35 am
We feed our dogs and cats a species-appropriate "prey model" raw diet. Since we have a farm and are raw-food suppliers, our way of feeding is not typical of the average pet owner, but we came to raw feeding in a fairly typical way.
We started in 2006 when our "old" Rottie was having hip issues, and we got a new puppy. Stumbled across raw feeding info on the internet (while searching for positive training advice) and went from there. Hubby complained about the cost of grocery store meat (and I complained about the lack of variety), so I set out to feed a varied raw diet for FREE, by spending time, being resourceful, and being willing to do the dirty work myself. It was successful, hubby shut up, the "old" dog started acting like a puppy again (he was 9, quite old for a badly-bred Rottie), and the old cat - once switched - stopped having FUS episodes.
Yes, it was scary at first, but I am the type who easily goes against convention. I was also a longtime, committed vegetarian for ethical reasons.
Since then I have discovered that all meat is not "factory" meat, that you can indeed raise or purchase meat from animals that have been raised ethically, naturally, and humanely. Pastured beef, chicken, etc. can actually ENHANCE environmental conditions - we don't have to rape the Earth to produce lots of good meat, we CAN leave the world a better place through judicious and sustainable production methods.
Since then I have discovered that you don't need to be afraid of raw meat. Grocery store meats I am still afraid of, as they contain 8-10% "fecal soup" and may be covered with chemicals or irradiated. I still don't like to "touch" meat - so I wear nitrile gloves when processing, and use tongs when feeding, and I clean everything with soap and water and sterilize with sunshine. Better yet, we feed plenty of whole prey also - where you don't touch the MEAT, it is covered by fur or feathers!
Since then I have discovered that dogs are carnivores, and opportunistic scavengers at that, and can easily assimilate any bacteria present in raw food. They are DESIGNED for it. If you don't screw up their digestive system with carbs and starches and cooked garbage, give them time to adjust to a raw diet, and be reasonable about it, a reasonably healthy dog can handle even the most rank meat without incident. That doesn't mean you *should* feed spoiled food to dogs, of course, but if they get into something you wouldn't intentionally feed them, they can handle it. We had a couple of hens that got stuck behind something and died, we couldn't find them until they started stinking, and when we did - the dogs grabbed them and took off, ate them entirely, and came back looking for more. Not so much as a runny stool, and these hens were *rank* - smelly, rotten, maggoty. Many dogs actually prefer their food to be "ripe", and will bury it to let it "age".
Cats, on the other hand, are obligate carnivores and hunters. They require their meat to be fresh. While they can probably handle "aged" food just fine as well, I haven't met one yet who would willingly eat rotten meat... except in commercial kibble.
There is a huge conflict of interest in the veterinary community with regard to pet food. Vets are indoctrinated in vet school, where they receive very little education in animal nutrition - and what IS taught is taught by pet food manufacturers like Hill's. Medical professionals in general are not taught nutrition or natural healing modalities. Western medicine is drugs and surgery. If you can't pop a pill, inject it, or cut it out, it's "bunk". If you don't erupt in flames, their treatment is "safe" and "successful". And very, very profitable. Besides that, vets risk losing their license if they recommend appropriate diets for pets, because they stand to lose revenue both from in-office kibble sales and from repeat customers. Raw fed dogs are healthy dogs.
As to cost - you can feed raw for free if you are totally committed to doing it, and have the time and space. You can also spend upwards of $5.00/lb on food - for a 60 pound dog who eats a pound of raw a day, that's about $150/month. Somewhere in the middle is where most of us stand. If you stay away from the expensive premade raw, and feed a prey-model diet from local sources, co-ops and mailorder suppliers, you can feed for an average of about $1.50/lb. That's about $45/mo for a 60-lb dog.
Cancer treatment, so I hear, starts at about $5,000. Dental cleanings run about $350 last I checked, and a kibble-fed dog will need one per year. So let's say your healthy kibble-fed dog lives 10 years and *only* needs a dental cleaning once per year, and gets cancer which you decide to treat. That's $8500. Plus let's say $1/day for high-end kibble, bringing your total to $12,150. If you feed raw prey-model, averaging $1.50/lb for food, you can avoid those vet expenses (usually) and feed raw for 10 years for $5400 total. You've saved $6750 over the 10-year period, and a lot of pain and heartache when the costly cancer treatment didn't work. Savings for smaller dogs are even greater - I just used a 60-lb dog as an example for ease of calculation.
If you're squeamish about handling raw meat or whole prey, you can feed ground food. However, this will confer no dental benefits, so you'll still have that $350/year cleaning bill, and the health problems that go along with a dog having dirty teeth. Teeth are a use-them-or-lose-them proposition with carnivores; they need to rip, tear, gnaw, and crunch. Kibble cleans teeth about as well as Oreo cookies clean ours! So, my advice to you is - "get over it already!"
Feed what Nature designed your dogs and cats to eat, apply common sense, and you'll have nothing to worry about. What was that saying in the '70s -You Can't Fool Mother Nature!
Nicole
http://www.prey4pets.com
"Let Us Prey"
Comment by Nicole — August 13, 2009 @ 1:54 pm
My vet recommended that I feed my puppy Science Diet when I first was blessed to get her. She is now 2 and 1/2 years old and I still feed her the same food only the adult version 1 to 7 years. She seems to love it and I also give her treats which she really loves to eat. The kitties are 12 years old and are on Science Diet Sensitive Stomach kitty food. I keep up with the updates on food but have not gone the natural food for any of them. I go by what their vet says to feed them. I might be doing it wrong considering what is being said about food but until the vet says "no way" on the food they are getting, that is what they are eating.
Comment by Deborah — August 13, 2009 @ 2:46 pm
Nicole is absolutely correct. You want to feed your dog the food it was designed for and that's mostly meat and bones. A dog fed raw meat and bones has a stomach with a ph level of 1-2. That will burn your skin! We humans have ph level of about 5. (neutral is 7). This acidic environment will kill most bacteria and keep a dog from getting ill.
A dog do not produce enzymes that are able to absorb nutrient from grains or cooked food very well.
I have two great danes that I have fed raw for about 10 years. Never had a problem.
Yes, raw meat can be gross and take more time to prepare, but what's good for my dogs is what counts, not what's good or convenient for me. That's how i think. I'll do anything for my boys.
Comment by Thomas — August 13, 2009 @ 5:23 pm
Nicole,
You mentioned a couple of times that one can feed raw for free, but didn't mention how. I'm a bit suspicious that I could do that legally where I live (northern Virginia...we have leash laws, so I can't let pooch rampage the "country"side for his abundance of bunnies and squirrels). Can you share some specific examples of the free raw meals?
Comment by Ed S. — August 13, 2009 @ 5:41 pm
I guess I'll chime in now that this blog was my suggestion. I'm so happy to see it get started. I didn't know if my suggestion would go anywhere. Thanks Nona!
Here's some background on me, especially since this blog has been doing some stories on rescued animals lately. About a year ago my boyfriend and I combined our two homes and today we have 5 pups. All but one of these are rescues. He had Keesha who is a rescued Peekapoo from a borderline hoarding situation and I had Lucie and Delilah. Lucie is a small Boston Terrier I got as a puppy and Delilah is a Pit Bull that a friend of mine got the owners to surrender because she was always locked out on a chain and sometimes would go a week without food. Since then we rescued Pete who is a young boxer that was headed to the pound for killing a rabbit and Hope... a young Boston Terrier survivor of the puppy mills. They love to run around on our farm and that's about the only way to tire them out!
I was planning on posting last night but we had a small min pin mix running around our parking lot lost and I didn't want him to get hit out on 460 so I was busy finding him somewhere to stay while we find his owners (needless to say we have a houseful already). I'm happy to report that he is in a nice fenced in back yard getting spoiled rotten til we recieve a phone call and in the case we don't the gentleman has said he'd love to keep him.
I am a 2004 graduate of VA Tech with a major in Forestry and I am working towards getting certified in the discipline "Healing Touch for Animals." This is a holistic form of veterinary care that can be used in conjuction to traditional methods. I also have a part-time pet-sitting business.
Now to our food bowls...
When I was growing up we just fed our dogs any old name brand of dog food and they always seemed happy and healthy. Back then you didn't have all of the hype about "good" and "bad" dog food and you didn't hear about your pets food being recalled. It seems to me that this push and "trend" of high quality food has really come about in the past 5 years. I'll admit that I have tried to do my research and have gotten fairly caught up in the dog food scares but trying to find financially feasible diets for all of our dogs is a chore.
As of now we feed Purina because unlike the other brands it has not been recalled. As far as I've found the only product made by Purina for dogs that was affected was the Mighty Dog brand pouches. I was feeding their top of the line Pro Plan variety but when they added the "meaty" chunks to it my dogs seemed to not like it as well so as of now they are eating Purina One Small Bites with Pro Plan can food mixed in. This food has some by-products and other things they say are not the best but it still has not ever been recalled. Both sets of our parents along with many friends of ours feed Purina's beneful which is relatively comparable to Purina One, some things are better (has vegetables and other vitamins) and some things are not (more sugar and corn).
I chose Purina just for the safety of my pets. Iams, Pedigree, Science Diet, Nutro, Eukanuba, Authority, most store brands, and more have been recalled. The list included most of the so-called top foods to feed. My food may not be at the top of anyone list but I thought it was about the safest route to go as far as a non-homemade food.
I would like to feed my dogs a homemade diet and I am looking into it some but as of now they would probably eat better than me if I did the recommended ones! I probably will give it a shot in the near future by at least supplementing their food. They already get carrots and most of them love them! Anyway, I will be experimenting with the brown rice, vegetables and meat products in the near future hopefully.
Thanks for reading my book and thanks again for taking my story idea!
Comment by Claren — August 14, 2009 @ 8:23 am
umm.... what happened to my comment... it was here earlier....
Comment by Claren — August 14, 2009 @ 11:05 am
My oldest dog, a 7 year old German Shepherd mix male, has been on numerous foods over his lifetime with me. He is 22 inches high at the shoulder and weighs about 47 pounds. He is in excellent condition. He regularly competes in dog athletic competitions and has the stamina and muscle strength he needs to perform at his peak all weekend.
When I first got him, my sister was studying to be a vet and got free coupons for Science Diet. So, we fed him that. For four months, he did fine. Then, his coat started becoming greasy and smelly. He also got a lot of flatulence. He gained weight even though he was exercised for hours each day. And, his waste was huge.
I switched foods to Purina One. Once again, he did fine on it in the beginning. His coat initially improved and his excessive flatulence went away. He remained on this food for two years before we started seeing trouble in his coat, weakened muscle mass, and stamina.
I switched foods again to Avoderm. This lasted two more years. At about this time, with the reemergence of coat issues, I talked to my vet and determined that what he might be experiencing is an allergy. Since most of the foods I had fed to this point were chicken based, I switched foods yet again.
For about the next year and half, he was fed Taste of the Wild High Prarie, which didn't have any chicken it in. He did very well on this food. I didn't have to feed as much to keep weight on him because there were more nutrients per kibble than the previous stuff I had fed. Also, his waste was smaller. After reading a book entitled "Performance Dog Nutrition" (which I highly recommend to anyone interested in canine nutrition) I also began feeding high-quality wet food - mainly 95% meat sources.
However, as happens, he started having issues with his joints and the effects of getting older. After reading online resources and talking with friends who were already feeding raw, I decided to switch my dog to a raw diet. He loves it! His coat is the best it has ever been, his teeth are extremely clean, his muscle mass is in the best condition of his life, and his stamina has never better. Also, pain associated with his joint problems has diminshed greatly. He no longer needs supplements.
I feed him a combination of various meat sources (found cheap at Kroger and WalMart): canned sardines, canned Mackerel, turkey necks, chicken leg quarters, chicken wings, pork neck bones, beef ribs, white tripe, beef heart, chicken livers, hearts, and gizzards. He also gets "vegetable soup" - carrots, sweet potato, apple, spinach, green beans, kidney beans, yogurt, and a little tomato pomace - all blended up into a "smoothie" for dogs. Amazingly, although we determined he was allergic to chicken, unprocessed chicken causes him no trouble.
Comment by Laura Green — August 14, 2009 @ 11:20 am
I feed my two dobermans a raw diet consisting of beef heart, ground beef, chicken hearts and gizzards, turkey necks and chicken wings. Sometimes I add steamed vegetables such as broccoli, green beans, carrots, spinach, etc. I also feed canned fish, which isn't raw, but is good source of protein and the dogs love it. If I have fruit in the house, I'll add that to their meals as well as raw eggs and yogurt. I switched my dogs from kibble to raw five years ago and love it. My dogs thrive on it and I get a lot of satisfaction from the fact that my dogs diet is never boring. Their stools are small and not nearly as smelly as kibble-fed dogs. They get very little plaque on their teeth and rarely need baths, as their skin is so healthy. Making the swith to raw did make me nervous but this book...http://www.switchingtoraw.com/....was a lot of help to me. It gives a very simple "recipe" for switching your dog to raw which I followed for a few months to get the hang of it. I've never done a cost analysis, but I believe I spend less buying raw meat than I would if I bought premium kibble. I'm always on the lookout for discounted meat, which saves a lot of money.
Comment by Sarah Keffer — August 14, 2009 @ 12:59 pm
I have a question for those of you doing the raw diet... I imagine it takes the dogs a while to eat their food with the bones, etc in it... Do you ever have problems with flies or bugs b/c of the raw food lying around? And is the smell a turn off at all?
Comment by Claren — August 14, 2009 @ 4:18 pm
No problems with bugs, flies, or smells. I keep the raw meat refrigerated or in the freezer in separate baggies (reused to lessen landfills) so nothing has time to go bad and begin smelling. After my dog finishes his dinner, I wipe down the floor with an antibacterial spray. The worse smell is the trash can, but that's easily fixed by taking out the trash more often.
My biggest problem with raw is that other two dogs, who don't get raw because they do just fine on premium kibble, keep trying to steal his food while he's crunching away on bones. I have to stand guard.
Comment by Laura Green — August 16, 2009 @ 9:47 am
Claren,
The food will not be in their bowl long enough for flies or anything else to find it. My dogs wolf their food down in a couple of minutes. Raw food does not smell much unless you mix in tripe, then you're in for a challenge when it comes to smell. But, you're doing this for the good of your dogs? So, for their benefit you can handle it ;-). Or, keep a bottle of "What Odor" it will clean the air instantly.
You don't want food laying around. Feed your dog once a day.
Comment by Thomas — August 16, 2009 @ 11:12 am
Wow!!! I had no idea that there were more then a couple other local raw feeders! I did notice a calling card that someone left behind though, on the trail at Kessler Mill Rd in Salem.. I was AMAZED to see some raw fed dog poop there.. And yes, you can tell the difference!! Kibble poop is massive and reeks, raw fed poop is small, doesn't smell and crumbles within a day or two.
I started supplementing with raw food back in October 2005 when I got a beagle mix (Tessa). I started out feeding her Purina, she was fine for a shot period of time but she started itching and chewing. Literally to the point of becoming bloody, she also had been diagnosed with Hypothyroidism before we adopted her. The vet tried saying that it wasn't food, it was fleas. But even after being treated with flea medication the severe itching continued. We switched her to Diamond Lamb and Rice, which helped a LOT. We tried a couple more kibbles but we weren't happy with them due to her allergies.
To make a long story short, I now have 4 dogs and 4 ferrets who all eat a raw diet. No veggies included, in the wild a wolf might eat some plant matter but normally only when times are tough and they cannot get the food that they need. Tessa was on .8mg of thyroid medication a day, but her body has slowly healed it's self. Right now she only gets .2 mg a day.
And with me feeding all my pets around 2000 pounds a year, guess what? I only pay a few hundred for all of it.. That includes deer, beef, chicken, goat, sheep, rabbit and more.
If any raw feeders between Wytheville and Rocky Mount want to know where they can get some good deals please email me with your location and I will try and help you the best I can my email is plava_93@yahoo.com
I know a lot of people think ferrets are herbivores but they are as strict a carnivore as possible, actually being called Super Carnivores. They cannot digest ANY vegetable matter what so ever, and the most common disease that they get (Insulinoma) is known to be caused by poor diets high in grains and sugars. Sadly it isn't as easy switching them as it is switching dogs, it takes time and I'm actually part of a volunteering team of mentors who help people make the switch at this website http://holisticferret.proboards.com/index.cgi
And do you want to know the best part of feeding ferrets a raw diet? They will no longer smell like ferrets! They just smell like the bedding that they lay on, wash their bedding once a week and they smell like the laundry detergent that you used.
And just a tip, if you must feed kibble. Go to Kroger and try Lassie Natural Way, a big 20 pound bag is $25 so it is cheaper then science diet and ProPlan which both run at about $50 for 35 pounds.. Plus you won't have to feed as much of it.
Comment by Maria — August 17, 2009 @ 12:45 pm