2008.09.17
Think you saw a cougar? You saw this. Maybe.
There are a few things in life that really drive me crazy. Things like whiny kids. Lying politicians. Sniveling celebrities. Obnoxious pro athletes. Paris Hilton. Cougar sightings in Virginia.
Some of you may find that offensive. Sorry. But I just can't stand Paris Hilton.
As for the cougars, people I know, like and trust swear they've seen them. I want to believe them. I really do. But based on the number of reported sightings, there would be some hard evidence. But there's not.
Maybe there's a former pet big cat or two running around out there. Maybe. Wild cougars? I'm not buying it.
I believe these folks are seeing something. But what? I'm guessing bobcats like the one above -- a monster caught on a trailcam in Franklin County -- account for a lot of "cougar" sightings. No. It doesn't have a long tail. Yes it has spots. But if you just catch a glimpse, are you really looking for the tail and spots?
Coyotes probably account for a lot of other sightings. And deer. And foxes. And house cats. And stumps.
It's not always easy to ID wild critters when your looking at them in pictures -- as evidenced by a current vaturkey.com message board discussion about two canines caught on a trail camera. They are clearly juvenile coyotes. Or maybe they're foxes. And is that a turkey in the background?
When you catch just a fleeting glimpse of anything in the wild It can be really tough to know exactly what you saw. I mean, on a deer hunt last year I saw a deer run by me so fast I couldn't even tell it was a deer. So, maybe it wasn't. Maybe it was a cougar. Or a sasquatch. Or a yeti.
The point is, until there is hard proof, there are no cougars.
You hear tales about hunters who have killed them, but didn't want to tell anyone for fear or getting in trouble. Yeah, right.
The one I really love is the story about bear hound hunters treeing cougars, but not shooting them or even reporting the sightings because they knew no one would believe them. Well, if you show up with a dead cougar, they're going to believe you. Heck, if you show up with a picture of an actual cougar in a tree they will believe you. And don't tell me these houndsmen don't have cameras. They do. They don't take pictures because they don't tree cougars.
Then there are the trailcams. Anyone want to guess how many trailcams are out there in Virginia? I wouldn't be surprised if it's 25,000 or more. And a lot of them sit over piles of bait that attract things like deer, squirrels, turkeys, raccoons and other cougar food. I've seen great trailcam shots of bobcats attacking deer. Eventually, a camera would get a picture of a deer getting nailed by a cougar over a bait pile. If there were cougars around. Which there aren't.
Cougars are verified in the Midwest. They can travel great distances. Eventually one or more will actually end up in Virginia. And when it happens, it won't take long for actual proof to appear.
For now, there is no proof. To me, that means no cougars.
On the subject of Paris Hilton:
http://givemeamillionparishilton.com
It would be nice to see her give up some money for a change!
Pass it on!
Comment by the spy — September 17, 2008 @ 2:50 pm
I really didn't expect the first comment on this topic to involve Paris Hilton.
Serves me right for mentioning her.
mt
Comment by Mark Taylor — September 17, 2008 @ 4:08 pm
Back when I was hiking columnist before my weather gig took off, I wrote a column (May-June 2003 or so, now lost in cyberspace) about a possible cougar sighting of mine on the Hoop Hole Trail in Botetourt County.
I do allow for the possibility that it was a bobcat, but I still believe it was more likely a cougar. I caught a 10-15-second look of it crossing the trail about 50 feet in front of me, did not notice the tell-tale spots of a bobcat, and at least in my memory perceived it to have a much longer tail and a longer torso than would a bobcat. Without a doubt, by its slinking body movements, it was a large cat, not a deer, dog, coyote or other animal.
It was a cloudy, damp day so the lighting may not have been perfect. Thunderstorms in the area led to my decision NOT to take my 35mm camera with me on the hike, a decision I rue to this day. If it were today, I'd at least have my cell phone camera with me.
Most curiously, my dog, who I was walking on a leash, did not react at all to the cat.
Comment by Kevin Myatt — September 17, 2008 @ 5:31 pm
Well Mark, Maybe Paris H. IS a cougar???? Nah, she's probably just a bobcat !!!
Seriously, I have not heard of but 1 sighting (?) here in Rockbridge a couple years ago. Did see the prints of that supposed cougar, and they left me looking back over my shoulder!
Comment by Wayne Huffman — September 17, 2008 @ 9:19 pm
Mark,
You might want to take a look at the pics on the link below. They say the cougar was hit by a car between Grantsville and Walker WV back in March of this year, but that's less than 3 hours from the VA state line. Now I've never seen one in the wild, but I would say that there has to be more cats running around in that area.
http://beechbrookhuntclub.com/
Comment by Matt — September 17, 2008 @ 9:22 pm
Kevin,
I remember your column well. You are one of those folks I include in the "know, like and trust" category. Still...
Wayne,
I laughed out loud at your comment. I'd say Paris is a cougar in training, for sure. I'm surprised you haven't heard more talk of sightings up there, especially given your line of work.
Matt,
That picture has been floating around a while. That big cat was hit by a car in Arizona. Like so many Internet pix, the story has changed as the photo has been passed along. Here' the skinny: http://www.snopes.com/photos/animals/mountainlion2007.asp
Thanks for reading and keep those cameras ready!
mt
Comment by Mark Taylor — September 18, 2008 @ 8:02 am
Mark,
I worked with a woman a few years ago who lived in the country on the Roanoke County/Franklin County border. She was always telling me of a "mountain lion" that she would see on her property. She would describe it as "big," "beige," "cat-like," and she was certain it was a cougar. She was finally able to get a picture of it, and of course, it was like all the pictures of Sasquatch and UFOs that you always see ... blurry, and incomplete ... a picture just good enough to prove nothing. It always made for exciting early morning conversation, and I would always insist that it had to be a bobcat or a coyote or a yellow lab. I've never seen a bobcat or a cougar in the wild (I used to live out west), or a wolverine for that matter. It would be exciting to see one of those animals in their natural environment. Thanks for the interesting article!
Comment by doug robison — September 18, 2008 @ 9:00 am
I realize folks make mistakes, but the big cat I saw in 2007 was not a bobcat. It crossed the road in front of me as I was jogging in early morning darkness. I clearly saw the long body and LONG tail behind it and its cat gait. I also saw the prints it left on the roadway. Cats are secretive which is why sightings are rare and people don't always have cameras with them.
Marlene A. Condon (Author, The Nature-Friendly Garden, Stackpole Books, 2006)
Nature Writer, Photographer, and Speaker
Crozet, VA 22932-2204
Comment by Marlene A Condon — September 18, 2008 @ 12:07 pm
As far a cougars go, I did see one on our land in Patrick county 6 years ago while turkey hunting. He jumped on a log about 100 yards out and I saw he had a long tail unlike a bobcat. Far and few b/w seeing one of them though. Not that I want to think of one around while walking to my treestand in the dark. LOL
Comment by Troy — September 18, 2008 @ 12:29 pm
What would the legal ramifications be if a hunter were to see/kill a cougar in the state of VA?
I'm sure the general public would be outraged and I would think that the DGIF wouldn't be very happy (and that may be an understatement) either, but it seems to me like it may come down to that before any belief is given.
Comment by Matt — September 18, 2008 @ 12:37 pm
OK i guess I may as well get in on this one, My story is just hear say, I didnt see it my self.. A friend of mine found one on 311 in craig and call game warden. With in 20 minutes there was a warden there with a blanket over the intire body and when my buddy pulled back up at the site the warden told him it was a deer. My buddy told him that he was the one who called it in and the warden explained to him that if the right person found out about this siting that the goverment could make some kind of safety corridor or a haven if thats what you call it for so many square miles around that area and we didnt want that to happen now do we. Like I said this is a story to me I wasnt there.....Like Mark said NO PROOF...NO PIC'S Mark this is going to go on for a while so hopefully you can post some more cam shots to get our minds on something else than a couger.... lol......Moe
Comment by Moe — September 18, 2008 @ 4:31 pm
Do the guys who saw a swallow-tailed kite at Rocky Knob have a picture or maybe a dead bird? Based upon the thinking above, I can't believe that they saw it without one of those things. Plus, if they have a picture, could it have been taken in GA and wrote off as Rocky Knob?
Comment by Donnie — September 19, 2008 @ 8:57 am
Mark,
I just happened to see the following article from a local radio web site after reading your blog this morning:
http://www.wtop.com/?nid=600&sid=1481252
(article about animal control in Blackstone setting up cameras to see if they can spot cougars)
Comment by Ed S. — September 19, 2008 @ 9:19 am
Doug-
Great to hear from you and thanks for the comment. I can just see that picture now!
Marlene,
You're right about the cameras. And even if someone does have a camera, these sightings are so fleeting that getting a good picture would be tough. It also doesn't help that many reported sightings are, like yours, in low light conditions when getting pictures is difficult.
Moe-
I think I know the friend you're talking about. Isn't he also the guy who saw the DGIF stocking coyotes (to control deer), the insurance company van releasing hybrid wolves (to control coyotes), and the Fish and Wildlife helicopter dropping rattlesnakes into Shenandoah National Park (to control hikers maybe?). Sorry. I just couldn't help it. And thanks for the suggestion of moving on. I posted the picture of that buck just for you.
Matt-
The eastern mountain lion is protected in Virginia. So, a hunter who shoots one with a gun could get into serious trouble. But, some might be willing to risk the wrath of the law for the notoriety that would come with being the one who finally settled this argument.
Donnie-
Great point. I suspect there are cases where rare bird sightings are mistakes. In the case of the sighting Seth Williamson wrote about in his column, it is about as credible as they come because it involved two experts who both saw and confirmed the same thing. If two cougar experts together spotted a mountain lion, had plenty of time to observe the animal and reported it, that report would carry significantly more weight than if one of us spots what we think is a cougar.
Ed S.-
Thanks for the link. That's an excellent article on the topic. Maybe those cameras in Blackstone will finally turn up conclusive evidence that wild cougars rome among us. I'd feel more confident putting money on the St. Louis Rams winning this year's Super Bowl.
mt
Comment by Mark Taylor — September 19, 2008 @ 11:47 am
My brother and I saw a cougar once at Smith Mountain Lake, back in 1984 or '85 . We were fishing on a paddle boat close to shore during morning daylight and saw the cat drinking from shore. We slowly drifted towards the cat and watched it for 3 to 4 minutes. At closest distance we were no more that 30 feet away. The cat was large, tawny and majestic looking. It had a long tail and no spots. Considering the optimal viewing conditions, we are sure it was definitely a cougar.
Comment by Mark Dulevitz — September 19, 2008 @ 8:47 pm
MOUNTAIN LION FACTS:
Mountain lions are solitary animals. They tend to live in remote country and are seldom seen by humans. They hunt their prey by stealth and ambush. Their method of killing is usually with a powerful bite at the base of the skull, breaking the neck.
Male lions weigh up to 165 pounds and grow to more than eight feet in length. Females weigh about 100 pounds. Female lions generally first reproduce at about two and one half years of age.
These cats have a wide range throughout the Western states, and populations are increasing. An individual cat's range depends on food availability. Thus, a range can vary from 10 to 370 square miles.
A mountain lion requires 8 to 10 pounds of meat per day to survive. Its diet consists of deer, elk, porcupines, small mammals, livestock, and pets. Generally a lion prefers deer. Experts tell us a lion kills one deer every 9 to 14 days.
The mountain lion population is increasing over most of its current range. This is due to two factors:
1. Food availability.
2. Lack of predator control. This population increase has a short-term benefit, but could create long-term problems.
The short-term benefit is that with more lions around, perhaps more people will have the pleasure of seeing them. The long-term problems are:
1. Decline in wild game populations due to uncontrolled predation.
2. Economic hardship - loss of hunting revenue, increase of livestock and pet losses.
3. Spread of disease by predators.
4. Attacks on humans.
A conservative estimate of what a deer is worth (in Texas) as a production commodity (i.e. non-resident hunting) is $1,400. Let's be even more conservative and say a harvestable deer is worth $1,000. That would mean, taking the estimate of one deer per lion every two weeks, one lion could consume up to $26,000 dollars of deer (if those deer were harvested by non-resident hunters) every year!
"WARNING" Lion attacks on humans increase when Lions become accustomed to man. Mountain lions are solitary animals. They generally hunt at night and, for the most part, are not seen by humans.
Lions are opportunists, meaning they kill whatever is easiest. Lions are well known to kill the young, both of wild animals and domestic livestock.
Here are a few documented mountain lion attacks on humans:
1. Spring, 1986 - Orange County, California - Laura Small, age 5, was attacked by a mountain lion in the Ronald W. Caspars Wilderness Park. The female lion attacked her head and dragged her off. Laura suffered paralysis of her right side and was confined to a wheelchair for a period of time. She has had 11 operations. Now Laura has a steel plate in her skull. Her right leg is weak, her right arm is partially paralyzed and she is blind in her left eye.
2. 1989 - Evaro, Montana - Jake Gardipe, age 5, was killed by two or three mountain lions (possibly a female with two kittens) while riding his tricycle in his front yard. The boy was dragged from the yard and the body was found nearby several hours later. The boy's home was 100 yards from U.S. Highway 93 just outside of Evaro.
3. 1991 - Nevada Test Site, north of Las Vegas, Nevada - Mary Saether, was attacked by a 120-pound female mountain lion. She suffered minor cuts and received 21 stitches on her head, right arm, and back. The cougar crept up on Saether and two male companions and attacked before they were aware of its presence. The two men beat the lion with their cameras forcing it to release Saether. A Wildlife Services Specialist arrived the next day. As he was doing a preliminary check, he heard noise in a tree and turned to find the lion charging. The man had only enough time to draw his handgun and shoot the lion at point blank range. The lion was found to be in good health.
4. 1991 - Idaho Springs, Colorado - Scott Dale Lancaster, age 18, was killed by a lion while jogging near his high school. Lancaster was attacked by a 90 - 100 pound female cougar and dragged some 60 feet away. When asked how severely the boy was mauled by the lion, Undersheriff Dave Graham replied, "Bad!" It took authorities two days to find Lancaster's body.
NOTE: These attacks happened in the Western Region were known Mountain Lions Exists, with out positive proof the best we can prepare for is black bears, yet with the increasing numbers of deers it would only seem likely a Mountain Lion will be photographed in this region.
Lastly nearly all attacks happened to small statued people i.e. children and small bodied adults be aware of your surroundings in the woods and parking lots.
Mountain Lions is not the only predator we have to worry about.
Comment by Static Lines — September 21, 2008 @ 11:28 am
This hits a nerve with me every time this subject is brought up. I am a graduate of Virginia Tech's with a degree in forestry and wildlife and I currently work as a forester for a local sawmill.
Needless to say, I am a big time skeptic of mountain lions in Virginia. As Mark pointed out you hear about people seeing them left and right, but there is no proof, or there is some made up story that goes along with it such as "a government representative came out and told us to keep the matter quiet". With the abundance of deer (the favorite meal of mountain lions)and no predators, a population of mountain lions would explode, just as the black bear has.
Most people want to see a cougar, and that is understandable. However, until there is 100% irrefutable proof I will still stand firm that there are no wild mountain lions in Virginia.
Comment by Nate — September 22, 2008 @ 8:08 am
Cougars are the UFO's for Virginia Sportsmen. We all want to see them so badly that "we hear them, sort of see them, and we definitely KNOW somebody who has seen one."
The facts are: there are no traces anywhere - NO DNA, no carcasses, so road kill, no trappings, no maulings (All self respecting Cougars like to molest a solitary hiker, biker or a fly fisherman deep in the forest now and then.) No Bears are ever killed with Cougar marks either. (Bears and Cougars get along like Cavs and Hokies)
We have excavated wooly mammoth's in Saltville, but guess what, so far, no Cougar bones anywhere.
I myself asked a VDGIF Biologist.. "Are they any Cougars in Virginia?" He said, "No carcasses, no cougars."
I said, "well my cousin Billy had this friend, who saw one get out a UFO near Fries last weekend - and he did not know what kind of spaceship it was, but he knew one thing, and it was a dang cougar getting into it"
Comment by Richard Formato — September 22, 2008 @ 12:25 pm
Richard a cougar and a UFO now that would be good around the ole camp fire with some fire water ha ha, but seriously from some of the biologist reports on the internet and Discovery Channel on the Mountain Lion.
If you see one it's rare, but more than likely it's stalking you as a meal. They are just that illusive here are three other stories I dropped...
A mountain lion attacked a 10yr old kid during a Little League Baseball Game running out to Center Field and grabbing the kid luckily a off duty police officer was watching the game he shot and killed the adult male lion.
1992 - Wenatchee, Washington - Jessica Vanney, age 5, suffered cuts and puncture wounds when a 60-pound mountain lion attacked her as she walked along a path through trees at a 100-site campground in Lake Wenatchee State Park.
Her father, Michael Vanney, witnessed the attack. "Jessica was 4 or 5 feet in front of me. She walked between two trees and I saw some movement out of the corner of my eye. Then I saw the cougar run around a tree and jump on her. Its front paws just wrapped right around her head and shoulders." Vanney grabbed his hunting knife and attacked the animal.
This was the third known lion attack in the state.
1992 - Vancouver Island, British Colombia - An 8-year-old Kyuquot Indian boy, Jeremy Williams, was fatally mauled by a mountain lion in the village of Kyuquot.
The boy's father and a dozen youngsters witnessed the attack. Jeremy was attacked as he sat on the grass in the elementary school playground. The cougar rushed and attacked the freckled, red-haired youngster as other children ran for help.
Kevin Williams, Jeremy's father and a teacher at the school, hurried to the scene and watched helplessly while children screamed in panic. The school's janitor shot and killed the 60-pound lion. Richard Leo, a Kyuquot Indian chief, said angry parents accused the school board of ignoring the danger of wild animals.
There is a previous story on August 5, 2008 under Mark's outdoor blog "Trailcam (troughcam, actually) picture of a big bear"
Where a Mountain Lion enter a home and grabbed a dog as food. It would be great to see a big cat yet in my opinion and from what I've read so far If you see a Mountain Lion....
You may be in a fight for your Very Life, playing dead won't cut it you have to fight back...
I am open for suggestions
Comment by Static Lines — September 24, 2008 @ 3:43 am
YouTube - Lion attack hunting safari Africa For those that think lions are those soft cuddling kitties in pet store even this one almost won the fight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0CNgwZgoKFc
Does the name Timothy Treadwell come to mind?
Comment by Backlash — September 26, 2008 @ 2:12 pm